The Museum of Hoaxes
LifeWave Energy Patches
Posted By:
Fawkes
Feb 24, 2005
 Now you can get more energy from a patch! I especially like the way that
they "believe" that it works. It is also based on years of research from
many fields. While the research may be valid, I'm not sure that their
results were intended to be used with a "patent pending blend of water,
oxygen, amino acids and organics applied to a polyester fabric and sealed
within a polymer shell".

http://www.contactplus.com/lifewave.htm

We can finally have our super-soldiers now!
Category: Health; Replies: 5918

Comments
Page 6 of 99 pages ‹ First  < 4 5 6 7 8 >  Last ›
Mark
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 12:28 PM
Uhhhh....I've had these things on for 7 hours now..I'm supposed to feel what,.. more stamina and energy?...

I feel like sh+t ,.. just like I did yesterday when I didn't have them.

Whatcha think edhuk?
Mark
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 01:45 PM
So, what you're trying to say is that the "full of sh*t" factor really comes in full force with this stuff.

I was told that I must have a reverse mag. feild and that it might take 2-3 days to get lined out.(?)

Also... why would it not be possible to just use the same set of patches, but just find other ways to apply to the skin when the adheisive is "worn" off? ... Sure,.. I know the obvious reason ($$)

just wondering.
Charybdis
in Hell
 Member
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 02:03 PM
"Have you ever heard the stories about ordinary people with ordinary strength show enormous feats of strength like being able to pick up an end of a car when someone was stuck under it.

The RestQuiet patch works on the same principle."


So the RestQuiet patch irradiates your body with gamma rays turning you green and hulky?

Don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 03:38 PM
I was told that I must have a reverse mag. feild and that it might take 2-3 days to get lined out.(?)

Also... why would it not be possible to just use the same set of patches, but just find other ways to apply to the skin when the adhesive is "worn" off? ... Sure,.. I know the obvious reason ($$)

MARK

Who told you this? And whatever happened to your plan to use an unsuspecting guinea pig to try out the patches on? You were going to tell them they were the sleep patches weren't you?

The bottom line is that responses to serious questions about LifeWave all bring the same result DELAYING TACTICS.

The whole idea is to continue the debate in various forums while meanwhile, back at HQ, the sound of a cash register going kaching kaching can be heard.

I still maintain that although many of the LifeWave distributors couldn't care less if the patches are genuine or not, there are some distributors, and many users, who genuinely believe in the product. Ask these people a serious question and they try to give you a serious answer. Their answers are straight out of the "What to do if you get questioned about the product" handbook...by David Schmidt, but even then, I believe many of these people continue to have faith that all is well in the Scmidt Kingdom. It's just that the rest of us mere mortals don't get it!

We are the one's who are missing out on the benefits of the patches. The chance to enrich our lives (while simultaneously richening a few other people's lives in the magic pyramid).

Don't forget that if you try to question a "believer" about the patch and throw any doubt on the authenticity of the product, you will get absolutley nowhere. By definition, you cannot question a delusion.

So, we continue the debate...remember the all important DELAYING TACTICS? Meanwhile, we trust that Attorney General Offices, FDA, 60 Minutes etc.etc. finally get their act together and put the patches, and David Schmidt in the "beam of reality".
Mark
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 06:30 PM
Edhuk..

Just got the patches yesterday and will be looking for a "subject" to wear them.

Meanwhile I still have mine on now and will leave them on 'till morning. I'm thinking that I will not have a problem getting any sleep.

oh and that would be the distributor, about the reverse magnetic feild.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 | 06:56 PM
Thanks Mark.

Don't forget to be very careful about patch placement. If you get them the wrong way around, or if you place them on the wrong meridian points there can be serious consequences. If you happen to wake up in the night and feel a burning sensation you might want to remove them.

The Lu1 meridian point happens to be called CENTRAL TREASURY...and I'm not making this stuff up!

Sleep well buddy.
Mark
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 | 07:28 AM
OK....had the patches on and slept with them on 'till 2:00 am (had to squirt)..then took them off.

I have them on today so that I can say I tried to get them to work and really wanted them to work, but I'm sure I will be disappointing the believers when my next posting will be that these things ...CANNOT WORK...

I'll give it one more test day to get "lined out"
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 | 10:32 AM
MARK

I predict your LifeWave distributor will tell you they did't work, YET, because you did not follow correct usage instructions. You are supposed to wear a set of patches every other day. Therefore any comments you make are worthless! Sorry, no prize from LifeWave.

Try harder next time, because the fault cannot possibly be in the patches, or the company. The fault is always in the user with zero results, the non-believers, scientists, "them", "the conspiracy against David Schmidt"...you get my drift.
music
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 | 03:39 PM
Guys, please give it a rest. I am a musician 7 could NOT care about MLM & etc. & these patches work if you are healthy, if you DO NOT understand or believe in eastern medicine, You won't get it. But i know they work and after Sept. with the people coming on board you will be SHOCKED & tons of NEW studies & over 400 doctors will be at the NATIONAL convention. Myself & some big-time musicians on major record labels are getting involved in this . I really wish all of you negative people could come on down to the convention. THEN you would NOT be talking so BIG
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 05:53 AM
MUSIC

Just out of interest. If a person wanted to come to the convention in September what would it cost them?

Apart from the flight and hotel, is there a cost to attend the convention and if so how much? Is the LifeWave meeting a completely self contained event or is it part of a bigger convention?

Thanks for the suggestion in your posting.
Captain Al
in Vancouver Island, Canada
 Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 10:15 AM
Can anybody go to this convention or do you have to be a Lifewave distributor? (What's the secret handshake?)

I doubt if I will be able to attend but I'll be eagerly waiting to see these new studies in peer-reviewed scientific journals. Of course, researchers not affiliated with Lifewave will be able to duplicate the results, will they not?

P.S. I'm surprised none of the thousands of distributors has taken up the JREF $1,000,000 Challenge now that the Lifewave company has bowed out. Since they "know" these things work, it would be easy money for someone. Maybe they are making so much money selling them they couldn't be bothered with a measly million dollars.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 03:58 PM
From MUSIC "Give it a rest"

I should imagine the easiest thing in the world would be to do just that. To sit back and look on at the scams of this world and not give a toss. Not care for the thousands (millions) worldwide who daily succumb to yet another con.

There are people who just can't do that in good conscience. I respectfully suggest that Bob at WWSN is such a person. There are many more but not too many step up to the plate.

In the process of exposing scams the deserving as well as the not so deserving are helped. But to people like Bob it doesn't matter if a con man's crony is cut a break through the exposure of the scam.

So when you say "Give it a rest"...that's easy. The hard part is not giving up on due diligence but continuing to push for real answers to real questions.

Surf on Bob!
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 06:10 PM
Checked out pricing.

Register now in your member back office! Pricing is: $139 between now and Aug 20th (Spouse is only $99)
$159 until September 2nd (Spouse is only $99)
After September 2nd $179 and $129 for spouse

Riviera Hotel & Casino $94 per person per night.

What a deal. Not only do you get to pay even more money to learn about the "product" you get to meet lots of "doctors" and famous, soon to be infamous people, and if you still have money in your pocket you can gamble in the casino. Perhaps if you put patches on the slot machines,white right, brown left, (that's the machine's left and right not yours) the nanotechnology can communicate with the electronics inside and give you the Jackpot.

Ain't life grand...ain't LifeWave grand!
Captain Al
in Vancouver Island, Canada
 Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 06:51 PM
Do you need the second patch on a one armed bandit?
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 07:01 PM
Absolutely Captain Al.

You have to complete the circuit. Remember the cell phone video?
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2005 | 09:26 PM
Like you said "You can fool some of the people all of the time"

In September you'll be able to see real faces of such people as they gather in Las Vegas for more pearls of wisdom from "He who cannot be questioned".
Terry Skidmore
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 | 03:57 PM
Not gone, just got bored with all the Flat Earthers who condemn everything before ever trying anything themselves. Closed minds are impossible to open with rhetoric alone and if none are willing to test for themselves they are thus as hard headed as the figures of Easter Island.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 | 05:14 PM
Oh Terry,

The whole point is that David Schmidt has told you the earth is flat, and you gladly believe him to the tune of $89.95 per month for 30 patches.

Meanwhile, in the real world, where you can't actually fall off the end, sane people are asking for proof that the earth is flat.

No matter how many times this forum talks about placebo effect or correctly conducted clinical trials, LifeWavers say the same predictable things. You guys haven't tried the patches therefore you must be idiots. Your minds must be closed...whereas our minds are so open and so easily influenced by hucksters like David Schmidt and his amazing LifeWave patches. We are more than happy to keep sending good money after bad because the patches really work...because I say they do.

The patches are so amazing that Governments from around the world have flocked to the Schmidt household begging him to work with them, and only them, in order to give their officials and their troops the edge they need in order to dominate the world. Great stuff!.

I would love to think the patches are real for the good they could do for many. I would also love to learn that they have been tested properly and in addition to doing what they say they do, they do not make my arms turn green after a year and fall off, or worse.

And so, Terry, if I am to be likened to the Easter Island massive stone Moai, I can only take comfort in the fact that the stones have been around for a very long time, and will be around long after David Schmidt has folded LifeWave and opened and closed his 4th, 5th, 6th etc. businesses in the pursuit of "just the right strength" of patch, the right backers, the right medical people, the right patents, the right distributors, the right location, the right time of the month etc, ad nauseum.

I know I sound cynical...but even though you might think otherwise, I truly hope you and many other believers can be treated fairly and squarly by David Schmidt. You deserve more than rhetoric, more than spin, more than paying $89.95 a month for a wing and a prayer in the church of LifeWave. I wish you well.
mark
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 05:36 PM
The patches can't work.

There is no possible way that it can do what "they" claim.

I purchased a 2 week supply just to prove they can't work.

I was even given the new "points" on where to apply the patches.... still don't work.

I wish the stupid things would work, but they can't.

There is just no possible way for "nano instructions" to be applied to anything that would enable FM waves to activate/communicate with our body to cause an action on a molecular level.

Bodies respond to what the brain chemical "tell it to do".
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 05:53 PM
MARK

Say it ain't so. You're a non-believer!

You now belong to the huddled masses of wretched outsiders who cringe in wimpering misery on the outside of the "in group".

The patches didn't work for you because you did something wrong, or you didn't follow the directions properly, or you wrote an email to Hoax Forum and David Schmidt sent a telepathic message to your patch antennas that read "do not work for this heathen".

It could not possibly be, under any circumstances, that the patches are a scam product, manufactured under the pretense of real science, but not verified by the scientific community.

And how do I know this? Because people like MUSIC use the patches and they feel something...therefore they must work, right? Can't get more scientific than that!

Don't feel too bad about messing up. The day of reckoning may not be far away for the Church of Schmidt. You can sit back and count the money you saved. You could always get some monkey gland injections...they're supposed to be good aren't they? Especially if you like bananas.
Mark
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 07:11 PM
You would think common sense would kick in and people would realize that if something were this good that there would be no need to have "people" try to convince potential buyers it works and for someone to demonstrate the patches to see if they work on the person buying them. The only thing needed would be a detailed chart specificly instructing where to stick the patches.

Give this to Wal-mart and there would be a whole lot more money to be made at a much faster rate than the current method Lifewave is using now.
scubasteve11
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 07:23 PM
I see you guys are still up to your narrowmindedness. (EDHUK/WWSN - did I spell it right??). All you keep doing is repeating yourself over and over again like a stuck record. Very entertaining I might add. It looks like you guys don't need any more energy as you sit in front of your computer all day long.

Mark - sorry the patches didn't work for you. They usually are not noticeable if you are doing nothing. Get some exercise, get in shape, write down your workouts and then wear them for a week.

David Schmidt does have a curriculum vitae which you have cut down instead of accepting. This is the 3rd try for the patches for David Schmidt because the other 2 companies also sold other items and it was not the profile that the patches needed. Lifewave serves this purpose.

I can't wait until the peer reviewed studies come out and get published. I encourage all of you to attend the convention.

Cheers
Mark
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 08:10 PM
Scub.

I'm at 24hr fit. 4-5 days a week running and lifting just as I have been for the past 4 years. Had the patches for about a week and even slept with them on.

I shouldn't have to "believe" they work ....the things should just work!

I want to be proved wrong by the peer review studies.

Tha damn things did not do anything for me like I read.....
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 08:57 PM
Scubasteve11

Nice of you to imply I am the same person as WWSN. Sorry to disappoint you, I'm not. You'll have to believe that because I say so. Just like the patches work because you say so.

Fascinating that you accuse people who have anything negative to say about LifeWave as being narrowminded, sounding like a stuck record. Then you go on to use the tried and true "counterarguments" from page 36 of David Schmidt's "bible".

"...you don't need any more energy".

"They usually are not noticeable if you are doing nothing. Get some exercise, get in shape,..."

"David Schmidt does have a curriculum vitae..."

"...was not the profile that the patches needed".

Now, remind me, you have no vested interest in the success of this scam pyramid MLM do you?

Being narrowminded includes not questioning anything that sounds too good to be true, and these patches certainly fit that criteria. The opposite of being narrowminded is pushing for answers to difficult questions. It is the nature of an online forum such as this that many pages of material are written. People are unlikely to read all the previous pages to compare with your comment. Hence the repetition of points.

And so, unashamedly, I say again that many people caught up in the LifeWave frenzy are decent, honest, hardworking folks...just like you maybe. They, and the rest of us mere mortals, deserve to see the "evidence" for the outrageous claims made by LifeWave.

You say thet you can't wait to see the peer reviewed studies. That's the whole point, neither can the rest of us. In science, peer reviews of products are freely available, that's why they are carried out. There would be no need to wait until September to see the results of peer reviews that must have already been conducted.

It's not so much that I can't wait to see what is offerered up, it's that I am very interested to see WHAT is offered up as evidence. Fascinating stuff.

And as for sitting at my computer all day long, you do not know how I spend my life. Perhaps I am on my death-bed with plenty of time on my hands? How I choose to spend my time is of no concern of yours, just as your hobbies are of no concern of mine.

Well, enough for now, and the cash registers continue to ring.

I'm sure September will prove that doubters like myself were wrong all along and indeed David Schmidt is the new Messiah. I look forward to hearing the interviews on Good Morning America, CNN etc. etc., for you know that the media will want to crown our savior and award him the accolades you feel he has so richly earned.
scubasteve11
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 10:47 PM
Mark

I encourage you to keep trying them on various points until you find the spot that works best for you. With some experimenting you WILL find a spot that works for you. Drink lots of water and wear them for 4 days straight on various acupoints. Some people are toxic and it takes 3 or 4 days for the patches to open up the bodies meridians. Good luck!! And you will be happy with the studies that will be coming out. They will take time to go through a full peer review but they will be submitted to credible journals for publication in the future.

EDHUK - I was not implying that you were the same person as WWSN. You both seem to think along the same left brain pattern. Take some time to research merdians, acupuncture, chi, and quantam biology.

I am not in Lifewave for the MLM as I stated before. I am in Lifewave to help people improve their lives. I do sell patches at cost to people and I am happy that I have been able to help improve and completely change the way people live that suffer from various ailments. I have also helped people get rest and to stop snoring.

I take offence that you call David Schmidt a Messiah or refer to him in any way as a god or talk about the bible. Leave the relegion out of it and I will agree to leave out my comments about the time on your hands.

I too look forward to the interviews with major networks. I'm not sure if this will every happen because people will always remain skeptical. Naturopathy and Homeopathy never get the credit that they deserve either. I truly hope that Lifewave will get the coverage it deserves.

By the way do you want to try the patches EDHUK?? They are a money back guarantee.
sotestit
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 11:18 PM
It can't be that expensive for other's to run some tests:


http://www.lifewave.com/studies_morehouse.asp



The Comparative data was collected on Thursday morning, February 27th. The study was set-up as a double-blind placebo controlled study. Prior to the testing day, a set of 60 envelopes were made up, numbered, and had randomly placed inside either a real set of LifeWave
sotestit
Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2005 | 11:21 PM
correction:

"other's" should be "others"
sotestit
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 12:02 AM
Interesting parallel:

"Castor oil has been used therapeutically for hundreds of years, both internally and externally. Applied topically, it has many beneficial effects in a wide range of conditions."

"For the strongest effect, use a hot oil pack. Physiological effects of the castor oil pack include stimulating the liver, increasing eliminations, relieving pain, increasing lymphatic circulation, improving gastrointestinal function, increasing relaxation and reducing inflammation."

---

This seems very similar to "heat transfer" and a patch, just a lot bigger.
Captain Al
in Vancouver Island, Canada
 Member
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 10:41 AM
Scubasteve11 still doesn't get it. The reason we keep repeating ourselves is we're still waiting for the explanation of how Lifewave is able to use "nanotechnology" to make FM radio transmitters that instruct the human body to change the way it functions. Currently, nanotechnology is theoretical. No one has made any useful devices with it, yet Lifewave claims to be mass producing revolutionary patches far beyond the present state-of-the-art. And all without even protecting it with a patent!

The other amazing thing I would like explained is how this revolutionary device transmits to a human body that does not have any way of receiving or using the data?

So will you finally enlighten us scubasteve11? or do we have to keep repeating ourselves?
Hairy Houdini
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 10:57 AM
yeah, Scubasteve- do we have to keep repeating ourselves? yeah, Scubasteve- do we have to keep repeating ourselves?
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 10:58 AM
MARK

Scubasteve11 stated:

With some experimenting you WILL find a spot that works for you. Drink lots of water and wear them for 4 days straight on various acupoints. Some people are toxic and it takes 3 or 4 days for the patches to open up the bodies meridians.

As an experiment you would have two variables to your design (and that's without it being a double blind study).

1: You are told to drink lots of water. (Many people feel better overall when they hydrate themselves correctly, especially in the Summer heat.

2: You are advised to try placing the patches on different points on your body.

If you indeed felt much better what caused the effect? The hydration level? The patches? The placebo effect?
Hairy Houdini
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 11:04 AM
hey, hey, hey... nobody opens my Body Meridian without buying me some Lourdes Water first..."Hydrate your Date", that's my motto... actually, my motto is: "Are you gonna eat that?", but that goes without saying, even tho I just did
sotestit
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 01:37 PM
Dr. Lauren DeRock has completed a study of the action of LifeWave Energy EnhancerT patches on 142 horses. Her study has been submitted for publication to a Veterinary journal. She will discuss her methods of using the patches in horses and the exciting results of her study.



This research has not yet been published and will not be available for review except at the convention. It will be available on the website after published in a peer journal. We expect this to be in approximately 4 mths.

Dr. Lauren DeRock, D.V.M. is a licensed veterinarian in California; graduate of University of California at Davis.
Mark
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 01:40 PM
Yeah......

...I've learned to drink water with everything I eat, and all day I might have 1 diet drink.

Been doing the water thing for about four years also..(along with w/o)



I sure would like to make all that cash..but if I can't get it to do anything for me..how could I convince someone else.

I guess just B.S.'em...huh!
scubasteve11
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 03:23 PM
That's an easy one Mark. The good part of the patches is that you don't have to convince anyone that they work. All you have to do is let them try them for a week using the 7 day startup program and they won't need any convincing.

Sounds like you are very fit. Have you tried the Liver 3 spot to detox your body?? Kidney 6 point is also very good for running.

Why don't you do a baseline test with them in the gym. Choose an exercise to perform. Warmup, stretch, etc. then choose a weight you can do 8-12 times. Do as many as you can. Then place patches on wrist points, rest 10 minutes and repeat the same exercise again.

I have not seen one person who did not achieve more reps and I don't tell them what they are prior to the trial. I have even told people they will make them weaker and they still do 30-40% more.

Good Luck!!
Waver
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 03:51 PM
I got a preview this past weekend of a study done by the lady below on LifeWave patches. Maybe her credentials will meet you approval.


Beverly Rubik, PhD.

An early look at a new study to be presented exclusively at the National Convention



Dr. Beverly Rubik is currently doing a study on how LifeWave Energy Enhancer
Waver
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 03:55 PM
Beverly Rubik, PHD Part 2

Professional Associations:

Bioelectromagnetics Society
International Society for the Study of Subtle Energies and Energy Medicine
Society for Scientific Exploration

Community, Civic, and Professional Services:

1997-2004 Optimal Performance Institute, Sunnyvale, CA. Lecture on health and wellness and heart rate variability measurements of clients.

2004- Scientific Director, Taro Dream, Inc., Kamuela, HI. Research and development of food and medical products.

2002-2004 Taught free yoga and qigong classes and workshops to patients and the elderly, Oakland and Larkspur, CA

2002-2003 Free consultations to Blue Planet Village on drinking water issues

2002 American Medical Students Association, Washington, DC. Development of detailed outline of medical school curriculum in bioenergetic medicine, funded by NIH.

2001- Clarus Products International, San Rafael, CA. Scientific consulting on consumer health-care products and electromagnetic interactions in biology and medicine.

1997- Presented numerous free lectures to the public hosted by various organizations throughout the San Francisco Bay Area, including the Health Medicine Forum, Oakland, CA; Parapsychology Research Group, San Francisco, CA; Mind-Being Foundation, San Jose, CA; Institute of Noetic Sciences, Petaluma, CA; California Society for Psychical Research, Berkeley, CA; New Frontiers of the Gold Country, Nevada City, CA; San Francisco Tesla Society

1996- Senior Scientist, Independent contractor to Institute for Frontier Science, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit corporation for scientific and medical research

1996- Consultations as holistic health educator to individual clients on nutrition, live blood analysis, biofield analysis, qigong, yoga, and heart rate variability testing

1993-2003 Starlight International, Monterey, CA. Member, Product Research Council, to help develop, scientifically test, and lecture on consumer health-care products

Awards and Recognitions:

2004-ongoing Professional listing in Who
Captain Al
in Vancouver Island, Canada
 Member
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 04:51 PM
"Research Director, Homeopathic Research Foundation, Oakland, CA
Lecturer, Institute for Culture and Creation Spirituality, Holy Names College, Oakland, CA
Adjunct Professor, Holistic Health Studies, John F. Kennedy University, Orinda, CA
Taught free yoga and qigong classes and workshops
Consultations as holistic health educator to individual clients on nutrition, live blood analysis, biofield analysis, qigong, yoga, and heart rate variability testing
Member, Editorial Board, Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine"

Wow, some creditials! Is Dr. Rubik on the leading edge of technology? Or did she fall off the side on the way there? It also looks like she has trouble holding down a job. Any particular reason why?

Waver, how did you get a preview of this study if it's being given an exclusive presentation? It seems odd such an important study is being released to a group of customers before it is peer-reviewed and published. Perhaps Lifewave wants to pull some more wool over their customer's eyes before real scientists have a chance to blow it out of the water. By then all the buyers and sellers will be brainwashed about the conspiracy against them.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 06:54 PM
As Jackie Mason once said in his stand-up routine. "Did I see a show! There were 100 dancers. Dancers going and coming, coming and going...whew what a show". Did you like the show? "I wouldn't say I liked it".

It's easy to spurt forth a huge amount of uncorroborated material. There will be tons of the stuff at the convention. Whew, will they see the evidence. Evidence coming and going, going and coming. Will any of it be of any scientific value? Very doubtful.

You can be sure of one very important thing. There will be enough to talk about for months to come and so David Schmidt will have achieved his #1 aim of the conference. More DELAYING tactics. Keep em happy and keep em confused...and keep sending in the money. Great stuff.
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 07:46 PM
Take at looki at Dr. Lauren.
She's just brimming with business opportunities.

Why waste your time with LifeWave patches when she can get you huge returns on your investment.

http://drlderock.my4life.com/opportunity.cfm

http://drderock.mytransferfactor.biz/personal_website.cfm?siteid=102944&CFID=8184148&CFTOKEN=17130405

RIOVITA Transfer Factor.

Do I need to say any more?
Waver
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 11:21 PM
An early look at some of the many activities scheduled for the

National Convention

Learn about the patches from the best .. athletes, researchers, and special guest speakers.

All this and more at the Riviera Hotel, Las Vegas

Choose from many breakaway sessions. Pick and choose these events to increase your knowledge.

Learn from the experts in many fields including researchers, athletics, networkers.

Meet the leaders and learn how they can further help you!

Rub shoulders with some of the best minds in many divergent fields!

Learn about new products! We have a surprise for you on our next patch for 2006!

Buy products at special prices. Buy 2 and get the 3rd free!

Buy selling tools at special prices; including the new low cost SpectraVision!

Learn about new books and placement points.


Here are a few of the many special guests who will be at this event!

Athletes
Pat Burris Judo Olympian & Olympic head coach
Mike Gailey Soccer
Mike Hartman NHL Stanley Cup
Randy Jones Cy Young Winner
Tara Kirk Olympic - Swimmer (2004)
Bruce Mathison Football
Stephen Miller USA Senior International Weightlifting Coach
Todd Pierson The Metabloic Project
Cyle Sage World's fastest triathlon swimmer
Jay Saldi Super Bowl Winner
Rhonda Smith-Sanchez North Pole
Courtney Zablocki Olympic - luge

Researchers/Scientists
Dr. Dean Clark
Dr. Lauren DeRock
Dr. Reenah McGill
Dr. Homer Nazeran
Dr. Beverly Rubik, Phd
Dr. Frank Shallenberger

Guest Speakers
Rich Lang
Patrick Netter
Patrick Rettew

Special Guests
Karyn Chabot
Dr. Len Horwitz
Dr. Lexis Johnson
Patricia Kimsey
Dr. David Kamnitzer
Dr. Howard Peiper
James Stevens
Dr. Lee Woolley

Corporate Attendees
David Craig In House Graphic Design
Ana Daras Marketing Assistant
Bill Grand Director of Marketing & Operations
Meredith Garrette Customer Service Manager
Michelle Hanchey Events Coordinator
Warren Hanchey CFO
Steven Haltiwanger Director of Health & Science
Sagi Kalev aka: Mr. NanoMan
Ron Morefield Director of Information Technology
Richard Quick National Athletic Director
Ken Rasner Executive VP
David Schmidt CEO & President
Christie Sparkman Accounting/Pay Cards
Waver
Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 | 11:23 PM
I forgot, me Waver.
Bushhog
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 02:00 AM
I have no opinion about this product either way. I do have one question, however. It seems everyone here is under the impression the company makes claims in the area of health. I have looked and I find no such claim. I was just wondering if these claims were possibly made by over zealous network marketers and not by the company, at all.
Captain Al
in Vancouver Island, Canada
 Member
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 08:53 AM
Bushhog, to answer your question go to <a href="http://www.lifewave.com/">www.lifewave.com</a>.
scubasteve
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 08:55 AM
Bushhog,

You are absolutley correct with your statement. EDHUK and WWSN are very thorough in examining the entire internet with some powerful search engines. They find over zealous distributors that have created their own websites claiming health benefits, FDA approval, etc. Websites are very easy to make. ANyone can make them...even Bob at WWSN. The corporate site has never made such claims.

Lifewave has had to choose an FDA classification that allows the distributors to distribute the product. The classification system for a product is very strict and there is very few classifications that the patches can fit under without being classified as a nutritional supplement, pain killer, etc.
scubasteve
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 09:03 AM
EDHUK,

I'm not sure what your point is about Dr. Lauren?? Who cares what else she does with her life. What does any of this have to do with her credibility? She has a curriculum vitae and you still find a way to bash it. My guess is that David Schidt did send one to you but WWSN has failed to acknowledge it.

I'm not sure what one's credentials would have to be for you to approve??

There are 5 studies that have been submitted for peer review and WILL be published in journals.SO once these studies get published what will be your next bash?? Why don't you just sign up as a distributor now.

I thought all of your TV networks were going to be at the COnference and bring Lifewave to an end?? Now you are changing your tune and saying that this will not happen at the Conference but will occur in the future. Make up your mind!!!
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 09:39 AM
Thanks scubasteve for thinking I am WWSN, but as I have stated previously, I am not. I am just like you, a private citizen interested in this whole debate. I don't own TV stations either.

The point I was trying to make, obviously not clearly enough, is that whenever a person gives glowing reports on a product, has conducted "trials" etc. but actually sells the product, there is a conflict of interest.

Locally, a physician's office has been closed down by the FBI. Selling vitamins in the office and suggesting to patients that they needed them didn't mix too well.

As for peer review. I thought the process was that a study would first be published in a respected journal, like Science, or Nature and would then be open for peer review and replication of results. I do hope the journals don't turn out to be "Bubba's New Products" "MLM Review" "Rich Beyond Dreams" etc.

Despite what you may imagine, I am very interested in learning the truth about LifeWave. Nothing I have read or been told by writers such as yourself has led me to believe that this MLM is anything more than an elaborate scam. I may be proved totally wrong. If I am, I will gladly state that I was wrong.

However, in being wrong, I will not have harmed, affected, taken money from, dashed the dreams of or done anything else to one single person. All I do is write postings in this forum. (My first and probably last forum).

On the other hand, if LifeWave turns out to be an elaborate scam, you will have sold a product under false pretenses, taken people's money (will you be issuing refunds to your customers?) dashed the hopes of achieving better health and energy etc. etc. You will have been complicit in the fraud and will have to take your share of the blame. That's why it's so important for the product to be genuine. Do you "know" that it's genuine, or do you "believe" that it's genuine. If you don't really "know" there may be problems ahead for you and many other believers.

I really don't wish that on anybody. I'm sure you are a genuine person who is very excited about this product, but is there just the tiniest chance that the excitement has clouded your good judgement?
scubasteve
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 01:52 PM
EDHUK - I do believe you are a different person than WWSN. You have intelligent thoughts and responses. And they are new each time. I appreciate our conversations 😊

WWSN and The Caped Avenger - Your record is stuck!! Your record is stuck!! I see you have fugured out how to copy and paste your comments over and over again.

I'm bored with this repeating nonsense.

I see how you operate. I answer your questions and you keep coming back with the same ones. I'm sure that is why Lifewave has finally decided to ignore you after trying to answer your questions. I'm sure your questions from them have been answered but you have your own agenda. Not sure what it is?? Or how much you are getting paid??

I'm outa here!!
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 | 05:34 PM
WWSN1

Thank you for peeling back some of the layers to reveal some very interesting facts. Dr. Nazeran is supposed to have conducted a trial with 10 people ( a number that is surely far too small for any kind of clinical significance?) However, even though he mentions placebo patches as well as the real patches (I use the word "real" in a lighthearted manner)there is no confirmation of a double blind study.

The effect of the people carrying out the study cannot be underestimated. That's why animal studies are so difficult to design.

Secondly, how on earth could any of us confirm any of his information? Who wants to pop over to China and take a team of qualified observers? You know, a bit like looking for chemical weapons in Iraq, but even less real.

There are going to be tears before bedtime, I can tell.
sotestit
Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 | 11:51 AM
Dr. Frank Shallenberger has completed a pilot study with LifeWave Energy EnhancerT patches to determine how they affect energy production and fat metabolism. His study demonstrated significant and dramatic improvement in mitochondrial energy production after only one week of patch use. More notable yet is the fact that there was an even greater increase in the percentage of energy, both resting and under exertion that was derived from fat. The health implications of such improvement are obvious. He currently is doing a 30 person study with the same protocol, which will be submitted for publication when completed.

Bio on Dr. Frank Shallenberger, MD
Dr. Frank Shallenberger, MD is licensed both as a medical doctor and as a homeopathic doctor. Dr. Shallenberger has been practicing medicine for 25 years, after graduating from the University Of Maryland School Of Medicine, and receiving post graduate training at Mt. Zion Hospital in San Francisco.

He is licensed both in conventional medicine as well as Alternative and Homeopathic medicine. This allows him to integrate the best of both approaches for optimal results. A member of the American College for the Advancement of Medicine, The American Preventive Medical Association, and the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine. He has served as a founding board member of the International Bio-Oxidative Medical Foundation, and is also a board member of the Society for Orthomolecular-Health Medicine. He is a past Clinical Instructor of Family Medicine at the U.C. Davis School of Medicine, and has been appointed by the governor of Nevada to serve on the Nevada State Board of Homeopathic Medical Examiners.

Dr. Shallenberger is a specialist in Anti-Aging Medicine, and is board certified by the American Board of Anti-Aging Medicine. He has published several scientific and clinical papers, and has lectured extensively in the United States and abroad. He is best known for his research involving the use of oxidative therapy for immune related disorders.
scuabsteve
Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 | 03:43 PM
WWSN,

I'm running because I feel so good with my patches on!!

I feel I add much more to the forum than your repeating ignorance.

I'm not sure what questions you want answered?? You have been provided with David Schmidt's curriculum vitae. You have been provided with the answer regarding classification of the patches. You have been provided with future studies by credible scientists that will be published.

Still running!! And still feeling good. A few more hours and I can apply my sleep patch. Good Night!! zzz zzz
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 | 08:14 PM
Scubasteve.

I would be interested in reading David Schmidt's CV. Where can I find it?

Many thanks.
scubasteve
Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 | 08:48 PM
While conducting undergrad and masters studies at Pace University during the 1980's, Mr. Schmidt received a grant from a private corporation in New Jersey for the purpose of investigating new and alternative therapies for immunogenic and non-immunogenic neuroblastomas. This work was performed in conjunction with the support of the Children
Mark
Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 | 07:01 AM
uhhh..........not working yet.....(?)



Hmmmmm...
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 | 08:43 AM
Thank you both to Scubasteve and WWSN1.

Scubasteve.

When you talked about David Schmidt's CV I thought you were referring to a legitimate CV that I had not seen on-line yet. I didn't realize you meant the fluff CV that has already been posted. Obviously I don't feel any more enlightened.

WWSN1

The nature of a forum with one page at a time on your computer screen necessarily requires a repetition of previously posted material. I find the information you provide fascinating as always.

Scubasteve

When you posted the CV info, did you believe that the information was given to you in good faith, and do you think that, as a CV, is is adequate to paint a picture of the background of an increasingly wealthy man in the world of pyramid MLM?

If Mr. Schmidt was to be nominated for a position in, say, Health and Human Services, would the FBI/CIA be comfortable and happy to sign off on the nomination?

The longer this debate continues, I feel a couple of things are happening. Firstly, and most importantly for LifeWave, the product is moving. As long as it sells money is made...simple MLM 101.

Secondly, the debate between various "believers"
many of whom, as I have previously indicated, I believe are honest hard working people)and those like WWSN1 who rightly question claims that seem implausible, becomes almost surreal.

On the one hand, WWSN1, and myself if I find interesting facts to post, attempt to keep the discussion based in reality and on factual verifiable information. If a man sells me a 24kt "gold" ring I can take it to a jeweller and have him confirm if it truly is 24kt gold or not. A real product tested by a routine process.

With LifeWave's patches things start to get a little tricky. LifeWave's own commisioned study states that the patches contain glucose (brown) and glycerin (white). The contents are described in a more thorough manner in the advertising literature.(Bigger words).

So, now I have a product that I am told will be a certain thing and do certain things to my body while not actually entering my body, so it can be registered as a heat patch, even though heat doesn't come into the picture.

Now I look around for the accepted routine process to test if the patch is indeed "24Kt gold". LifeWave assures me that many studies have been done, some at Colleges and Universities in the US. Morehouse College used to be mentioned by name. Now it is a "College in the SouthEast". I emailed Morehouse some months back because I was genuinely interested in learning about the double blind studies with college athletes. I was told that Morehouse was putting their legal dept. on to the problem. Morehouse's name was removed.

Now, with the conference a few weeks away we are beginning to get "sneek peeks" of "studies" and "Doctors" who will provide convincing evidence that the patches are genuine. The sheer volume of this "evidence" will be overwhelmimg. If it is all true after all, that would be wonderful. We could all sit back, take a deep breath and say "Fantastic, I don't have to write on this forum anymore. I can put may time to better use".

So we will just accept everything at face value, buy the ring (you remember the 24kt "gold" ring) and tell ourselves that the funny stain on our finger from the "gold" ring is because we aren't wearing it right.

WWSN1

I take my hat off to you. We will always need people who are willing to be our sentinels, our watchdogs, to warn the pack that something is possibly amiss.

We continue.
scubasteve
Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 | 09:56 AM
EDHUK - I agree with your statements. Lets sit back and watch it all unfold.
mark
Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 | 01:26 PM
..........................nothing yet...........
Dr.Boris
Member
Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2005 | 03:23 PM
I really enjoyed reading all the 21 pages of the discussion. Thanks a lot to WWSN for providing the link.

What surprised me is the fact that many of you explained positive testimonials by the placebo effect. I have a much simple and more probable explanation for the vast majority of them (the testimonials):THEY ARE LYING TO MAKE MONEY!

According to their website, "the materials in the patches consist of a patent pending blend of water, Oxygen, amino acids and organics". Sounds similar to skim milk and raises an important question. Do they need to be kept refrigerated? Have you ever tried to keep a bottle of milk out of refrigerator for some time (or even a couple of weeks in refrigerator)and then open it? DO NOT TRY IT AT HOME. So, my advise to the guys that want to investigate the liquid inside the patches: be very, very afraid. Trust me, cleaning an electronic microscope will not be easy.

I must say it is a lot of fun to read the information on the LifeWave website. "The pulsating magnetic field above the human body passes through the patches"- what a gem! What about the magnetic field below the human body? My conclusion is the patches are most effective when used on the ground floor (basement is even better). DO NOT USE THEM AFTER A TAKEOFF! The magnetic field will be below you, and plane may crush when it (the field) tries to pass the patch.

I must admit that I am a big fan of the WWSN and James Randi. That would automatically disqualify my opinion in the eyes of any true believer regardless of my credentials (B.S. and M.S. in Biotechnology, Ph.D. in Engineering, licensed professional engineer).

WWSN, keep up a good work!
EDHUK
Member
Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2005 | 03:59 PM
Dr Boris,
There's an old saying that's as true today as when it was first uttered. "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".

No matter how many logical arguments are put forward by WWSN1 and others, there are people out there who continue to believe in this scam. I'm sure there are plenty of folks who just want the money and couldn't give a toss if the things are real or not. As long as they can see where they fit into the pyramid, and that they aren't too far down in the pecking order, they will do what it takes to make the big bucks.

So what if David Schmidt is about to make money by holding a "conference", as long as they pick up tips on how to con more people into buying into the dream.

A dream of a better life. Feeling better every day, feeling stronger, able to do more work and still have energy for other activities. Who wouldn't want that? Why shouldn't a person make money out of it if they "believe" the patches work?

But how many "believers" have just a tiny feeling, deep down, that all is not quite right with this company. Better just look at the LifeWave video one more time and check out the "studies" done at Troy University and Morehouse College, just to reassure oneself.

Oh I forgot, Troy University and Morehouse College disowned LifeWave and issued cease and desist orders to stop using their name.The Olympic Weighlifting Association wants nothing to do with LifeWave.

Well, better just ignore those as not meaning much anyway. There are far better, more "convincing" studies coming out at the conference. Yeh, that's right, those studies will prove all those naysayers wrong, you just wait and see. Won't they all feel stupid when we continue to make loads of money selling the glucose and glycerin patches that "talk" to my body and tell it to burn fat and make me strong!

Of course it does cross my mind that if the patches really do switch on the fat burners, what happens if they don't turn off again? I seem to remember back in the days of World War II ammunitions workers getting into trouble with the explosives when they put the stuff into the bomb shell casings. Didn't some of the workers die because their fat burners had been turned on and couldn't be turned off? Very high fever followed by death, I believe. That couldn't happen with these patches though, could it Mr. Schmidt?

David Schmidt is in the perfect position of "knowing" that the patches couldn't do anyone any harm at all. Why? Because he knows they contain glucose and glycerin and don't actually do anything, harful or otherwise, at all.

Big sigh of relief, we are all SAFE.

What the heck, it's only money anyway, right?
Dr.Boris
Member
Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2005 | 06:05 PM
To the TRUE believers only:

Just wanted to let you know about another brilliant idea. The Lifewave patches may possibly be used for male enhancement (if applied at the right place, of course). Try it! Cannot wait to read testimonies on that subject.

Gee, what would be the right place to apply them?
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