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Prove God Exists and Get $1,000,000
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Posted By:
Lord Lucan
in somewhere strange
Jan 12, 2005
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<a href="http://www.thinkandreason.com/" title="Think and Reason">Think and Reason</a> is offering $1,000,000 if you can<b> prove</b> that God exists. There are conditions attached. But they do say: <i>"All you have to do is prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that God exists. It is really that easy!"</i>
Is there really this money sitting waiting?
Supposing I said I was God - and prove I exist (should be easy) - is the money mine?
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Comments
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Page 7 of 24 pages ‹ First < 5 6 7 8 9 > Last › |
Lindsay
Member
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 | 10:14 AM
im not gonna go around and dig up stories i dont have time for that. and i no of teachers who have not been allowed to do things like that. its not like its new news and its not like im just making it up. its happening. in many places the rules are being streched to far. and im not critizing our countries laws. im merely stating, that most of america is making it clear that they dont want God in their lives. youre right that is there choice. i didnt say that i should force my religion on them in any way or that any religion should be banned. im saying that you cant expect God to push his way into lives that dont want him in there. idk how much simpler i can state that. and i dont no y you apear to not be understanding this. if you dont agree then please tell me why and just stop quoting everything i say we all no wat i said. if you chose not to believe me on the teacher thing fine w/e its not a big deal. but its obvious that as a whole, the country is taking God out of. sure he still reigns in peoples lives. but we used to be a country under God, thats going away now. and im not here to argue about wether or not thats right. its completely irrelevent wat i believe in the matter. once again all that i am saying is that God isnt going to force his way into peoples lives. and alot of the world is making it clear that they dont want God in their lives. thus, you cant blame God for respecting the free will that he has promised us. if you have an arguement or dont understand that then respond to it and not trivial things that ive said that really dont matter and dont need debated about.
and as ive said before, bad things happen. i no that you dont believe in God, but, if im right and my God is real, then he will know better than you and you cant use your own morals to shoot down his. his ways are better than yours. so unless youre perfect and can run this world better, please use a different, better, way to argue your side.
an abaaya is those things that women wrap around their heads like in the muslim religion. but we dont need to cover this part because its irrelevent like i said before if you dont believe me about the accesories that teachers couldnt wear, then go ahead with that. it doesnt matter. it was an example. |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 | 02:19 PM
Lindsay said:
"im not gonna go around and dig up stories i dont have time for that. and i no of teachers who have not been allowed to do things like that. its not like its new news and its not like im just making it up."
So, you don't have time to look up any sources for this "story" but you DO have the time to spread it around. Interesting.
You say you "no of" [sic] teachers who have not been allowed to wear crucifixes. You mean you have HEARD of such cases, right?
The bottom line here is that you don't have any legitimate sources for these stories and don't intend to back up what you're saying. You want to believe in this urban legend and you aren't interested in having your bubble burst. You're entitled to believe in whatever nonsense you want, but you really shouldn't go around claiming that things you can't back up are true.
Please don't bother to repeat that you "know" the stories are real; repetition proves nothing. Either provide some credible source(s) for the stories or admit that you don't have one. |
Lindsay
Member
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 | 02:39 PM
holy crap didnt i just say that i couldnt care less if you trusted wat i said? and so you make a post completely about something that doesnt matter. ok just pretend that i never said any of that because it really doesnt matter. i dont have time to digup stories i have h/c tonight and im getting ready to go shopping for some shoes for it. not to mention i have about three more pages of a report to write. if you dont trust it oh well it doesnt matter
the real point that im making, is that a good amout of the world wants nothing to do with God. i simply stated few examples of that, if you dont find them reliable. oh well. its not hard to reason with yourself that America is saying get out to God publicly. yes there is a large amount of individual people who still allow God into their lives. my point? God isnt going to force his way into someones life, therefore saying that you dont want God in your life, and then critizing him for not being in your life, doesnt work. people dont want anything to do with God, so until they do, he wont force his way in their lives. really, that is the point, so debate that. |
Lindsay
Member
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Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2005 | 02:41 PM
btw im not saying wether or not its wrong for america publicly to not be devoted to God, but to worship him indvidually. it is simply a fact. i thought id make that clear so that we dont get into an uneeded debate or something |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 | 12:34 AM
Lindsay said:
"holy crap didnt i just say that i couldnt care less if you trusted wat i said? and so you make a post completely about something that doesnt matter."
Well, I think it DOES matter because you, and other people as well, believe this myth. Lindsay, what you don't realize is that I've had this same discussion with people in the past.
A couple of years ago, I was active on Yahoo Chat where a person made the same allegation about teachers being fired or reprimanded for wearing crucifixes that you made here. I asked that person for a credible source for that story and guess what? Suddenly, they, like you, "didn't have the time" to look it up. According to them, too, I was just supposed to take their word for something they couldn't back up. Sorry, but I think that, on some level in your brain, you know this story isn't true and that failing to find a source for it would be a threat to your need to believe in it.
I realize that some Christians want to believe that they are being martyred by American society, but it just isn't true. Tell me:
What church has been forced to close?
What belief has been outlawed?
Who in America has been told they can't believe whatever they want?
Answers:
None
None
No one
I submit that it is objectively true that no religious belief is being banned, outlawed or otherwise interfered with in America. If anything, Christians are trying to shove their beliefs down peoples' throats via this "Intelligent Design" nonsense proposed for public school science classes.
I really don't care what you believe, so long as you don't ask me to pay for it or submit to it in any way.
Please stop making the false claim that religion is being persecuted in America. It simply isn't true. |
lindsay
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 | 12:29 PM
im going to try and make this perfectly clear, just one more time. never, did i say that christians were being treated unfairly or that the country was even doing anything wrong religiously. I'm not trying to say that America is bullying us and taking away our rights because thats not true. I have great rights, and I don't have a problem with them. I'm saying that people are pushing God from their lives and that he isnt going to force his way in life's that hes been banned from. Free will. please try and understand that is the point, the arguement, the only belief that i am stating here. u cant blame god for the natural disasters and such. ppl want nothing to do with him, so there you go, they have it. im not saying that its bad that America doesnt allow christianity to run the nation. I'm just saying that it doesnt. do you understand? because if you dont, I really dont no why, and im not explaining again. theres no reason that someone as intellegent as yourself cant unerstand a basic sentence
"Suddenly, they, like you, "didn't have the time" to look it up. According to them, too, I was just supposed to take their word for something they couldn't back up. Sorry, but I think that, on some level in your brain, you know this story isn't true and that failing to find a source for it would be a threat to your need to believe in it."
hah right w/e. i just have a life, and frankly, that doesnt sound fun, and isnt nessacary. so tell me why i should waste my time on it. actually im wasting my time right now because for some reason you are set on discusing things that dont matter like ive said, idk care if you dont believe me. if you need facts for every single little thing, if you have that much of a trust problem, then thats ur prob and not mine. dont trust me on something so stupid that would be pointles to lie about. its your choice. and i didnt say that they got fired. i said that they couldnt wear them. either way it doesnt matter, i was merely using it as an example to say how America is pushing God out publicly. and once again, I am not stating an opinion on that, just stating the fact. wether its right or wrong is not relevent. so lets get down to real topic. seriously, wats going on? why cant you seem to talk about the subject? im sure that you have something to say that will contridict it, im sure that it doesnt leave you speachless. so w/e u have to say about it, say. the other crap doesnt matter.
so once again, just to make sure that everyone understands. this is my arguement
America publicly, doesnt live by God, indivudually many are pushing God away. Most people dont devote their life to God. Most people dont want anything to do with them. God gave us free will. if we want to live life without him, then we will. so you cant really use the arguement of "where was God when the hurricanes hit. or "where was God when my aunt got cancer." and such statements. for many, God was were they wanted him. not overriding their freewill and butting into their lives.
ok now that was as simple and clear as i could get it. please, comment on that. and not teachers or w/e |
lindsay
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 | 12:31 PM
"Please stop making the false claim that religion is being persecuted in America. It simply isn't true."
never did cranky. nope. never did. u just didnt understand wat i was saying for some reason |
Lindsay
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 | 02:24 PM
oh yeah, and just so i know where you stand, what is your belief on how everything came into existance? you no mine, so itd be nice if i new yours |
Scott
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 01:43 AM
Hi Cranky
I am also curious about your feelings on the statement:
"God isn |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 02:46 PM
Scott said:
"I am also curious about your feelings on the statement:
"God isn |
Lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 03:00 PM
actually cranky, if there isnt then i need you to correct my logic. because the way i see it there must have been a God for everything to have began
yeah im sure that you dont buy into that. but really, i dont see any other way. like the big bang theory. that can actually fit into creationism if im not mistaken, which i very well could be, probably lol. havent given this that much thought. but i do no that the big bang theory offers how the universe was created, but how the creater of the universe was made. it says that all of the energy that existed accumulated and exploded in all directions, but if im not mistaken, it says that were the energy came from is a mystery. so what i see here is not only and incomplete theory, but possibly a link in God's creation of everything. theres two possibilities of how the energy got here, one, it created itself from virtually nothing, or two, something else created it. if that something created it, then the same rules apply. so on and so forth. so where does that chain end? spontaneous generation was long since proven to be false. so then according to the laws of the universe everything must havea beginning, and have come from something else. so think about that. if that is true, then that means that nothing would be here. something had to start everything off. that means that w/e started everything, defined the laws of the universe, and created itself from aboslutely nothing. also it must have been around for all of time..it must have created time. if that is so, then that means that its a supernatural being wich would make it God. i dont see any way around this, if there is, then please shed light on the issue. and i mean..the issue. dont side track or anything. if you dont agree that there must be a supernatural being then explain why with facts plz
the way i see it, i dont see why it couldnt be my God that started everything off. and im not saying that i believe the big bang theory, i merely consider it
i hope that all made sense |
lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 03:47 PM
you know what actually, i think that I may just quit the site for good. im a firm believer that the universe is to complex for our minds, and that i can never begin to grasp who God really is. what i mean is, i dont believe that everything in the universe can be comprehended by our minds. and just because we cant comprehend something doesnt mean its not true. i cant constitue everything as fact. just the point that the world argues over where they came from proves our race knows very little about the universe. if you dont where you came from, then you really you dont no who you are. and to not no who you are..well that is a sad thing. until ppl no that i dont believe that they can even began to make theories of where the universe was made, because it goes farther than that. it goes back to the very first thing to have ever existed. when someone believes that they no that, then they may debate the issue. its kinda like missing your primary vairable in an equation. that will completely through it off. idk if you have a belief on what the very first thing to exist was or not. if you do then maybe well continue this. but i cant prove christianity and no one can disrpove it. ive always known this. thats why people must personally expiernce God, why no one can justify in facts why God is real. hes to complex for us. and actually, by trying to say that God is only real if we can understand the proof and teach it, is dramtically closing in boundries on GOd. God has no boundries. so theres no way that you can even say in your own mind that God cannot possibly be real, that doesnt even go by our definition of God. BEcause, if God can do anything, then he can exist despite small minded beings logic. so, i have lost nothing. if im wrong, then i guess that I just become nothing or w/e but if im right, i will be in heaven some day. :down: if youre wrong then you pay the worst price possible and spend all of eternity in the worst pain you could imagine. so, its up to you i guess. you could literally bet everything that God doesnt exist, something that no matter how much you believe it, you arent capable of even proofing to yourself. im sry for wasting everyones time, idk wat ive been thinking debating on here. theres nothing to prove. i am like a wave in the ocean. i come an go that quickly in the eyes of all time. how much can a wave possibly come to learn the short time its in the air? the wave cant learn enough to say that the whole world around it must fit into its thinking..its small thinking based on what its seen and learned in its short time. that goes for both of us i guess. you cant explain the universe in theories or in facts, i cant possibly explain why my God is real. maybe you think thats foolish. oh well. people have been wrong before. but i think taht understanding your limitations is wiser than trying to excede them and fail. take what you want from what ive said. but someday, you will no that God is real. i only pray that it comes before its to late. and until the day you realize that, youll laugh at the statement i just made. most likely. youll probably even laugh about that.
and this isnt my way of running away, its not my way of just believing without facts. its my way of realizing, that i will never no enough facts to completely believe like that. im to stupid for that hehe. actually its very unlike me to do this. i get very competitive, admitting my limitations is almost impossible. i dont run away from things, im way to stupid for that lol. actually you just read a correction that i got from god. yay. so believe me or not. but i hope that someday you realize, the universe will not fit in your mind. something isnt true because its a fact, its a fact, because its true. most of those truths will never become a fact in our small minds |
lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 03:48 PM
bye cranky and everyone else, i hope that you make the right choice. and argue against this all that you want, but it wont change what I'm about to say, and i do mean this with all of my heart. Jesus christ loves you more than anything in the world. he loves you with a love stronger than any logic or fact. a love that surpasses all knowedlge. a love that if you ever got even a taste of, youd no was real despite the ignorant logic of the human mind. its never to late to go to him. he will always love you, and is always waiting. all that you have to do is tell him that you dont want to keep him away any longer. life hurts. he can help that.
later |
lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 03:51 PM
ill be around long enough to explain the theory i had on the last page, but after that im outta here. please remember to comment on that, i am actually interested in what you have to say to it. ive never really had a chance for any one to contridict me on it |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 06:10 PM
Lindsay said:
"its gotten to the point were teachers will get in trouble for wearing a crusifix on their necklaces, for wearing the star of david buttons which isnt quite christian but ridiculous all the same. a teacher last year couldnt even make copies of a flier for a christain group at my school."
So, Lindsay, when you wrote that, you WEREN'T saying that Christians were being harrassed? You seem to want to back off that point since I've asked for documentation.
As for your other point, people make decisions on whether to believe or not believe on an individual basis. That is the way it should be. If more people are deciding NOT to participate in organized religion (and I don't know if that is true), well, the problem may be that organized religion isn't meeting their needs.
If anything, with the push to teach "Intelligent Design" in public schools and other initiatives, religion (particularly of the Christian brand) is being pushed down the throats of those of us who don't want any part of it. |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 06:13 PM
Lindsay said:
"actually cranky, if there isnt then i need you to correct my logic. because the way i see it there must have been a God for everything to have began"
Many people believe that, but it is a theory, at best. There is simply no evidence that there is a God. If, according to you, "there must have been a God for everything to have began [sic]" how then do you explain God? Isn't He supposed to have existed forever? You can't accept the concept of a self-created universe but you CAN accept the concept of a self-creating God. In what way is that less difficult to understand? |
Lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 09:39 PM
i really dont feel like repeating myself. plz read my explanation more thoroughly because I clearly stated that it was plausible for the matter that started the universe to have created itself. if you didnt understand that, then im not sure what to say about that. its simple. and who is to say that the matter is a part of my God? you will never know. like i said, youre never going to be able to condense everything to fit into your own logic. so i guess that youll spend your life on an impossible quest. and no this isnt my way of blindly following something.
i would like to add this final thought. if the universe did create itself, and the matter was God, then you cannot put any sort of limitations on it. none wat so ever because it has already defied your laws. so it very well could be part of my God. but i guess youll never no. maybe the universe did create itself, maybe my God is the universe. after all, everything came from him. everything begins and ends in him. id say its plausible that he is the universe. so yeah it is easy for me to believe that the universe created itself. I doubt that whatever created this universe is a simple as energy. it fabricated all of this. dont under estimate it. there is a bigger picture to the creation of time space you me everything that we no and even everything that we dont no. its something that you can never figure out on youre own much less provide enough evidense for it to be constituted as a fact. just plz, think out of the box if you must. consider it. dont make a mistake because you could only see a small part of the picture. its surprising how different something can be than what you once thought it was. you could be right in some ways, but many times, youre not completely right. be careful before you bet your whole life on something.
as i said before, I'm not saying that I believe in the big bang theory or that the energy from it was God. its just a thought.
i dont see any point in debating this further. if you want to contrdict it then do so correctly. its not hard to understand what im saying, so please try to not misunderstand me. as i said before im going to quit this site once my last thought was understood. dont want to leave things unfinished lol |
lindsay
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Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 | 09:50 PM
"If anything, with the push to teach "Intelligent Design" in public schools and other initiatives, religion (particularly of the Christian brand) is being pushed down the throats of those of us who don't want any part of it."
i honestly dont see how that is relevent. and i dont see any reason why i should have to provide evidense for something obvious. i never said that christians were being harrassed or mistreated. idk how many times i must say this, but im simply making a point, that God is not runnning america as a whole, many individuals are pushing him out. im not making an opnion on that either. its a fact. and im not going to discuss this any further, its gotten ridiculous that you cant understand that. it honestly does not pose any sort of theat to me. dude i go to school almost every day if my whole freakin life i think i no wat my teachers are allowed to do. i no wat theyd get in trouble for. im not going to waste my time cuz you have such a terrible trust issue. it doesnt matter. im sry if you think it does. find someone else to argue it with about it
believe it or not, i dont find it entertaining or even useful to sit and look up stories of teachers and their rights. woot stinkin woot..not.
my point is that people said go away to God, God listened cuz he gave them free will, and he went away. now, if you have a problem with this still, then im sry. but i cant make it any more clear. i see that youve had problems with ppl trying to give you crapped up stories of teachers being mistreated. christians whinning about their treatment must be very very unnerving and it seems like you hear it alot. i however do not have that problem. i believe that i am very free and have great rights. no one threatens me religiously blah blah. of course theres things in america i dont agree with, there always will be. but this isnt about that is it? i actually never made any opinion on that. i just was tired of hearing ppl ask where God was when they got hurt, after they had pushed him away. it was unnerving.
so im done with this topic, if you feel the need to go any further i guess that you can role play. bit strange...but hey desperate times desperate measures. im sure it would be interesting.
if you understand what ive said, and dont have any amazing contridictions to either of these two topics, and by that i mean the theory of how there must be a God, and the whole where was God when blah blah happened, then i believe that i am done here.
if soo later have a great life sincerely hopet hat you dont suffer eternal damnation |
Scott
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 | 01:20 PM
"hope that you dont suffer eternal damnation"
"if im wrong, then i guess that I just become nothing or w/e but if im right, i will be in heaven some day. if youre wrong then you pay the worst price possible and spend all of eternity in the worst pain you could imagine."
Sorry... but saying things like this (above quotes) is reasons why non believers don't want anything to do with religion. That is no way to have a relationship with anybody - the scare theory "you better believe cause you'll burn forever" doesn't work for me. I believe because of what God has done for me. God is the ultimate judge. If I didn't believe in God, why would I want to go to heaven anyways or feel like I'm missing out. If at some point I change my mind about God existing. Why would I care about Hell?
I think you need to re-read Revelation cause those who choose to not go to heaven will not be burning forever. I can give you some proof texts if you'd like.
There is a little something called Grace. I think Cranky knows about it cause it sounds like he has read enough bible text (which is cool cause he is looking at both sides of the coin). Grace is not a ticket to do what ever you want cause God will excuse you anyway, but a way of Christ to say "I see your background and will take that into consideration". One sin is no worse than another and I think that honest study on how we got here - and an incorrect conclusion will be taken into account. That is different than knowing that there is a God and saying flat out "I don't want anything to do with Him"
Jesus Christ wants everyone in Heaven - Period.
Hope this makes sense cause I'm writing quickly cause I'm at work 😉 |
lindsay
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 | 03:01 PM
"the scare theory "you better believe cause you'll burn forever" doesn't work for me."
lol i think that you misunderstand me. and im very sorry to anyone else who did to, i was writting in a hurry, and i tend to say things wrong. lol. alot. i dont believe in scaring people into becoming christians, they should go to God with love in their hearts, not because they feel forced and scared. i do believe that they should fear God as in a revering him and noing that he is their judge. but i dont think that should be the thing to win them over.
but that does not mean im going to hide the fact that they will suffer in hell if they dont go to christ. i dont want them to and so i was serious when i said that i hoped that he didnt suffer eternal damnation. i am actually very serious about that. believe it or not it would make me cry!! lol
its the truth, wat i said about if hes wrong thenn hell suffer forever. i just want him to actually consider that. its real. and it can happen. i hope that maybe hell realizee the chance of that, and possibly consider looking at the picture in a different way. im not trying to scare him to God. aside from the fact that i dont believe in that, i cant scare him to GOd. he just cant be scared into something like that.
i no wat youre talking about in revelations, well i think its wat youre talking about lol. and im sry but i understand it in a different way. after the tribulation, when God makes the new earth and such, for a millinium he will allow the people who did take the mark of the anti christ, and who were still alive when he came back, to live there. they will have a 1000 years free from the devil to make their choice. however, the people that took the mark of the beast and who were already in hell will be thrown into the lake of fire forever. hell is more like a holding cell until that time..
i dont really want to talk about that. its sad to think that ppl are really going to go through that. everyone gets the picture anyway. i think thats wat u were talking about, but im not sure
im sry but please dont be so quick to judge my words in that kind of way. the scare theory is also something that i oppose strongly. i to believe in grace, and i thank God for the grace that he has given me. hes done alot for me, especially this summer. i no very well what his grace is. i wouldnt be here today without it. im sry i probly said those quotes or w/e the wrong way. i do that alot lol
actually, i usually dont preach about hell or w/e. i let ppl no that that is wat awaits them if they dont chose God, but i most certainly dont use it as a scare tactic. i just allow them to no the truth. after that. well. thats when God's grace comes in. which is a beautiful thing |
Carter S
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 | 10:15 PM
I for one DO believe in god. Very strongly. But I also have no evidence for him existing. To me it really doesn't matter what any one thinks. But I do think that people like Cranky Media Guy and Captain Al are good for people. Big Applaud. I have been talking to these guys for a while now on the Sylvia forum. Although I do not agree with some of their stuff.
But the reason why they are good for us is because they help us think out side of our actual beliefs. I mean to think one thing all the time and not actually thinking things through can really make you brain washed.
Whether they realize it or not, they are helping people THINK, and not believe everything that comes their way.
Even though they don't keep an open mind about things. They are at least giving believers a second look. Then the believers can stay with their beliefs or not.
Later |
Carter S
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 | 10:18 PM
On the sentence "Although I do not agree with some of their stuff." I forgot to add "I do respect their opinions". |
lindsay
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 | 06:47 AM
yup yup. i really appreciate that they are willing to hear us out. most adults wouldnt give a crap about what i had to say on here and its nice to be allowed to talk, and be taken seriously. i cant tell you how rare that is. so i guess thanks really lol
alright well like i said before im going to be leaving this forum. cranky idk y but i really feel the need to ask you this, and for some reason im terribly interested in the answer. are you happy?
lol sry its a bit unconventional of me to just ask something like that for no reason. i hope that you dont think its strange. o um well i guess i can ask everyone if their happy to 😊 lol good now before i leave i can make sure that everyone is happy ^_^ yay.
idk if ill be posting again, so id like to do this now. but i want to challenge everyone who reads this to keep an open mind about everything that comes your way. look at the picture different than other ppl do. alot of the time the answer is the one that no one will think of. ill take that challenge upon myself as well lol so it would be cool if you did to.just a request
later |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 | 02:39 PM
Lindsay said:
"alright well like i said before im going to be leaving this forum. cranky idk y but i really feel the need to ask you this, and for some reason im terribly interested in the answer. are you happy?"
In general, yes, I am happy. I do have an occasional problem with depression, but that's organic and treatable with medication, not a indication that my soul is "yearning" or something.
Generally speaking, I am happy, though. Like anyone, there are things I would like to change in my life, but they have nothing to do with "finding God" or any of that stuff. I certainly realize, and remind myself often, that I am a LOT better off than a lot of people. I haven't been washed out by a hurricane, for example.
In my experience, religious people don't seem, as a group, to be happier than the non-religious people I've known. It's an individual thing, I'd say. |
lindsay
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 | 02:57 PM
lol ok i wasnt speaking religiously.
"In my experience, religious people don't seem, as a group, to be happier than the non-religious people I've known. It's an individual thing, I'd say."
exactly. religious. all the ppl that i no that are in a real relationship with God are happy, even when their life sucks like crap. actually ive come to hate that word lol. and i think that there is a reason why ppl who are christians, but arent right with God, are generally less happy any way. actually theres a few reasons. but i really have to get going so i dont have time to put them down. maybe later if i have the time and someone is actually interested...
i wasnt asking if you were happy so that i could preach to you. i was actually interested 😊 so its good that ur happy. |
Carter S
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 | 06:05 PM
I'm HAPPY!!!!
I think that my belief in God has taken me to a whole new level of happiness. the more I think about him, the more happy I am.
I also believe in God because there is just too many things that couldn't be what they are today without God. I mean look how so many things come together in this world. It's amazing.
I mean come on. we came out of the ocean. next thing we know we have hands, feet, heads that can think logically and rationally. To me, that is all nonsense. I think we came from god.
None of this could be possible without God. In my opinion.
ps. Cranky media and Captain al. In case you were wondering, when I said I applaud you I wasn't being sarcastic or anything. I was being sincere about it. You help people THINK. I respect your opinions, and I really do think about your views.
later
see you guys on sylvia!! |
lindsay
|
Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 | 06:50 PM
:) yay. i no wat you mean. now that ive had a taste of God, if i dont have him i get sad. but when i do..man..its the kind of happiness that is definetly supernatural. even through all of the terrible things that happen. something really bad happened to me in august, but the very next day i was still able to laugh and smile with my friends. and thats God's grace. seriously, i would no be here today if it were for God's mercy. hes saved my life in all possible ways. i only pray that other ppl can see that. its something that you must experince for themselves. and i dont believe that anyone can tell me that it wasnt God making me happy. right now i should be a depressed little girl who cries herself to sleep with what happened. and guess wat.. im not!! thank god im not lol. no one can tell me that is normal. nope. cuz im as happy as can be and definetly dont cry myself to sleep. ive actually come to find so much good that came from it.
and come to think of it..i dont see why ppl just assume our minds are creating these symptoms of God to appease our natural needs and desires. everyone has a need to be loved, protected, and to have a purpose. theres ways to meet all of our other needs such as food water oxygen. i mean yea sometimes we cant get to them, but they still exist. why would it be any different with this? i believe that all things exist for a reason, and nothing has ever shown me prove of that being false. even tiny little fungi and stuff serves a purpose. i dont believe that we would just be here to exist. theres no point. so there would just be nothing.
idk alot of ppl will disagree with that..but i still believe it. its a shame. the world has become so vile..so trecherous, that people learn to trust nothing. its gotten to the point where most ppl dont believe anything untill it can be proven with hard facts otherwise. and for somethings thats not even nessacary. but in order to survive in the messed up world people have to think like that. it sad. and because of that, ppl cant even trust miracles any more. even the miracles that are most assuerdly miracles. everyone automatically assumes that everything is not as it appears, everything. like our minds need love so we create love with a God that we all believe is real with every fiber of our being. in this world its more logical to think that our minds created the being, rather than it actually being real. we cant even trust our minds to be honest with us anymore.
ahh sry i just went on a little tangent didnt i haha. 😛 heh i just start thinking...and then i type it..and all of you must suffer through reading it. im a rambler..
ps. i would like to you guys to. all of you whom ive debated with. you guys tore apart at everything in mt theories and words that you possibly could and its really taught me alot. its made me think. and believe it or not, that thinking has made my belief in God stronger. im looking at things from a perspective that isnt always conventional to me. and God has shown me alot of things through it. so many things in science that ppl think contridicts God, i believe, when looked at out of the box, as a whole, can make sense with christianity. maybe some day wen im older and wiser ill be able to piece more together. until then, you guys have helped me begin the process. thanks a bunches hope that life is good to you. and i really do hope that you can find the truth. |
Carter S
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Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 12:20 PM
Lindsay,
I am glad that you still believe in god, despite others words.
I am a strong believer and for everything to be chance is just NUTS! I mean if we look at everything and then simplify it to it's original beginning, then we might have proof of a higher power.
Let's take a hat for instance. Ok, it's made of cotton. We get cotton from cotton fields. People plant cotton seeds in their fields. That cotton seed was somehow formed and created by our forming earth and it's weather. And it serves us a purpose for keeping our heads warm, our bodies.
I mean look at trees, they just happen to give off oxygen.
When someone asks me to prove if god exists I just tell them to look around. We are proof. Our earth is proof. Our food is proof. our thinking minds are proof.
If someone says 'well plants are fed by photosynthesis, that's why they grow, not because of god' then I will reply 'Photosynthesis isn't possible without god'
All these people saying that the paranormal is fake and that nothing can just exist from nothing, but believe we formed from nothing, need to realize this. If we are living, and formed from nothing, then they might want to reconsider their standing on the paranormal.
I am sort of talking like a philosopher.
I ramble on too. as you can tell.
Later. |
lindsay
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Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 02:47 PM
hah yeah i have that problem too. lol either im rambling like a kid or like a philosopher.
no one is ever going to be able to scientifically prove that God exists or doesnt exists correctly. God is much to complex and amazing for that. our minds cant possible grasp the kind of evidense the ppl on here want us to provide. i wouldnt be surprised if ppl one day think that they find proof that means that there cant be a God. but it will never be correct because chances are they only find a small part of something bigger. that seems to be the way the world always goes. misunderstandsing..so many lol. to me it only makes sense that their is a God. i hope that everyone on here is one day able to look past their human logic and see the bigger picture. thats why i put my personal expierince above any logic that i may have, im just a retarded kid lol what do i no?
"I am glad that you still believe in god, despite others words."
huh? |
Cranky Media Guy
|
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 06:27 PM
Lindsay said:
"If anything, with the push to teach "Intelligent Design" in public schools and other initiatives, religion (particularly of the Christian brand) is being pushed down the throats of those of us who don't want any part of it."
i honestly dont see how that is relevent. and i dont see any reason why i should have to provide evidense for something obvious."
Well, it's relevant because it contradicts the notion you seem to have that America is moving away from God, or however you might want to put it. If anything, religion is being pushed upon America as a whole by politicians who want to use it as a means of control, in my humble opinion.
ID is a religious theory (more like an opinion, I'd say) which has no place in a public schools' curriculum. The fact that it's being pushed is evidence that religion not only is NOT being diminished in America, it is being PROMOTED, in contradiction to the idea of separation of church and state.
"God is not runnning america as a whole, many individuals are pushing him out. im not making an opnion on that either. its a fact."
Well, there have always been people in America (and elsewhere) who do not wish to participate in organized superstition, AKA religion. So what? It may be a fact, but it has ALWAYS been a fact.
"dude i go to school almost every day if my whole freakin life i think i no wat my teachers are allowed to do. i no wat theyd get in trouble for."
I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but I'm quite sure you're wrong about this. I've asked you for any proof that teachers are told that they can't wear a crucifix and you have refused to provide any. Why don't you simply ASK one of your teachers if this notion of yours is true?
"im not going to waste my time cuz you have such a terrible trust issue. it doesnt matter. im sry if you think it does. find someone else to argue it with about it"
It isn't a "trust issue." It's simply that I've had this identical debate with other people in the past and the outcome is always the same: I challenge their assertion that any teacher anywhere in America has been told that he or she can't wear a crucifix; they say it's true, but when I ask for verification, they suddenly say they "don't have the time to look it up" and continue to claim that it is true anyway. Seriously, you're not the first person I've had this conversation with and it always goes the exact same way. You WANT to believe this, but it just isn't true. If it was, a simply and quick Google search would put me in my place. If this had actually happened, especially if it had happened mroe than once, don't you think the teachers' union and the ACLU would step in, making this an even EASIER story to verify?
"believe it or not, i dont find it entertaining or even useful to sit and look up stories of teachers and their rights. woot stinkin woot..not."
Well, it may not be "entertaining," but it would be informational, don't you think? Do you WANT to believe in things that are provably false? |
Carter S
|
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 08:17 PM
Lindsay,
Yeah the way I wrote that was weird. I am just saying that even though people are debating you on whether or not God exists, you don't put up with it, and you still believe in him.
I don't think that we can ever find proof here on earth. The way I wrote that made it sound like we could.
I was just trying to state that if we look at it in a certain way, it would be hard to think that there isn't a God. I just don't think all of this is chance. I don't know I have a headache from school. I might not make sense now.
oh well.
later |
lindsay
|
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 09:30 PM
cranky-
you would consider my asking a teacher proof? i thought that you had to have facts and i could lie or w/e because you seem to think that this is really important. so if its important couldnt i just lie? which i wouldnt but then if i am a liar then you cant trust that either.. :blank: ill just shut up now lol im starting to ramble on about nothing. if you really want proof that terribly then ok..ill ask one of my teachers..lol not that big of a deal. if youll contistute my word as proof then sweet easy research!
and you seem to not be understanding the point that i was making about America not standing for God as a whole. but it doesnt really matter. so its cool. maybe im just explianing it weird. lol
"organized superstition"
hehe nice
carter-
ahh school always seems to do that. <_< i was playing paddle ball in PE and this kid hit the ball as hard as he could wen he was about three feet from my face..as you can imagine, it didnt feel very good. lol. so my head kinda hurts to. hehe i almost got blinded by it :lol: but for some reason i had my hand over my left eye, which is good..cuz now i can still see
i just want to say sry right now if i start rambling and just not making sense, im really tired, hyped on mt dew...and im bored lol. not a good mix. hehe im hyper... |
lindsay
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Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 | 09:31 PM
yay lindsay started a new page! |
Carter S
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 01:18 AM
I just came from the sylvia forum and am obviously very tired. But I do have to say that, I think, if God wasn't real thennnnnnnn.... I lost my train of thought. oh well, I will be too tired for work and football practice. AAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!! I will finish my sentence tomorrow. |
Cranky Media Guy
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 02:26 AM
I thought that some of you might be interested in the fact that the Catholic Church (the largest denomination in America) has just officially announced that not all of the Bible is accurate. Yes, the Catholic Church says that you are free to disregard large portions of the Bible.
Here's your link:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-1811332,00.html |
lindsay
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 11:11 AM
thats not news isnt new. theyve been trying to say that for a while, but its their interpretation of the bible. most catholics believe that the stories of the bible are meant to be symbolic and arent historically correct because they are mostly just fiction or w/e theyve been saying this for a really long time... |
lindsay
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 11:12 AM
hah i dont no wat happened to that first sentence but i meant, "that news isnt new" |
Carter S
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 12:41 PM
I think that the devil is symbolic.
I don't think that God controls the weather. Even though he can Im sure. But this is a place of heart ache, and it is our test to see things through and react in the right way the best we can.
I think that we are all animals with animal instincts, and I think if we do screw up then God will understand and forgive us. To me life is just a test, but if we don't pass our test, then we may take another one. It's the biggest test of all. So, screw Math!!!
All religions say a lot of things, like mormons, think that they get their own planets when they die and are gods. They also think that brown people are neutral souls, which means that they haven't decided to follow God or The devil, so they're neutral.
But some religions have something that they change at some point in time. I don't know that's my guess. |
lindsay
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 05:55 PM
why do you think that the devil is symbolic? |
Carter S
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 06:26 PM
Well, I mean I use to believe that he existed, which he very well could. But I don't know. Like when Jesus said " then satan offered me all the power and wealth, but I turned by back to him, and walked off" (Not exact quote, but very similar). I take that as Jesus knew that he could have power and wealth. Because of all his teachings, and he knew that the people loved him(some, not the ones who wanted him dead obviously). But I think he was tempted by it or just knew he could. He thinks that all of that is evil. So by calling it Satan, I think he was saying that he had a bad temptation. Which in this case Temptation=evil=satan. I don't know, that's how I take it. But I would also rather not believe in him. I would rather have my attention on god rather than satan. |
Carter S
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Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 | 06:28 PM
That quote I wrote could be right on or not, but that's how I remember it. |
lindsay
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Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 | 02:31 PM
oh ok |
lindsay
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Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2005 | 10:19 PM
actually wait, what would the point of the devil being symbollic be? that makes everyhting more complicated than it really is. why cant the bible just be real? not some mystical puzzle that has you wondering what is real and what is just a story? |
Cranky Media Guy
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 12:50 AM
Lindsay said:
"why cant the bible just be real?"
Well, if it is, then just prove it and win the money. Should be easy, right, since it's true and all. |
Scott
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 12:48 PM
Like other history books on egyption kings and such, there is archilogical evidence that the places and locations and kings where there that where written about in the bible - but the money is for proving that God exists. We'll probably be able to prove that around the time that scientist prove that the world started with a bang and that the 10 to the 52 power chance that all the matter that was needed to begin life was present and perfectly fused together to start life. |
lindsay
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 05:55 PM
cranky-
many times the truth is the hardest thing to prove. it seems like its always the gentler thing in life, the thing that you have to dig around for more. i believe that the bible is real, but proving that historically is something i am definetly not qualified to do. you believe that God isnt real, so why havent you proved that? Should be easy, right, since it's true and all. teehee...yeah anyways...
i was saying that for ppl who believe in the bible, why cant they just believe in all of it? Why do they pick and chose at what is right. why? are some things conveint to have real and some symbolic? or maybe they think that some of it isnt possible so they say its made up. i dont agree, and i guess that i dont understand. so for those of you who believe in the bible but think some of it is symbolic, why can it not all be real? |
Tyler
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 06:45 PM
I'll be registering soon so I can come back and post the link, but recently I stumbled across an article which states that Catholics themselves will not even swear by the bible as truth anymore...
I find that quite interesting, and maybe a decent addition to this large list of threads. |
Tyler
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 06:57 PM
And just after posting that I see the post by CMG posting the link.
Damn!
-goes back to working instead of playing- |
Carter S
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 06:58 PM
Lindsay,
I think it's symbolic, but yet I do find it to be real. I think that in some ways, the bible was meant to be symbolic, for instance to me the devil. I rather just not give satan, if he exists, my attention. I don't think that people should base their religion on the devil, but on loving and giving their attention to god.
(Not saying that you base your religion on the devil or anything)
But although I think he is symbolic, I could very well be wrong.
Lindsay, I agree with you. A lot of people say 'prove that god exists', and I as well say "prove that he doesn't"
I guess we will never no that answer until we die. But until then, I think god exists, I love God, and I will live my life always believing in God.
Lindsay, don't forget about the sylvia page. good discussions going on there. If you need to see her for your self watch her on montel on wednesdays. give us your thoughts on her.
Later. |
eriC draveS
|
Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 | 10:56 PM
The problem of the "proof" of God's existence is that one must prove it for oneself, and one cannot prove it for others. This isn't actually the kind of Greek philosophical-mathematical proof that other people expect.
As far as I can see it, God will furnish physical proof of his existence when he comes back. Until then it's either faith or self-proof.
The "proof of the Bible" that my church taught was that the Bible said when Tyre was destroyed that there will never be a city where Tyre stood, and that therefore all one has to do is build a city where Tyre used to be to prove God doesn't exist. Of course that is ridiculous (how many people out there, other than Donald Trump, Bill Gates or Rupert Murdoch, can just go out and build a city?) but it is all that has been given. |
Cranky Media Guy
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 01:52 AM
Carter S said:
"Lindsay, I agree with you. A lot of people say 'prove that god exists', and I as well say "prove that he doesn't"
Carter, I say there are flying kangaroos on the dark side of the moon. Prove there aren't! I dare you! I believe it and that settles it.
See the problem here? You cannot prove a negative. That's why you don't HAVE TO in a debate. If you say there absolutely is a God, the burden of proof is on YOU.
If you think that's wrong, then disprove my belief in flying kangaroos on the dark side of the moon. Remember, simply showing me pictures of the dark side of the moon won't cut it; the kangaroos hide when there's a camera present. You know, just like God. |
Cranky Media Guy
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 02:04 AM
lindsay said:
"you believe that God isnt real, so why havent you proved that? Should be easy, right, since it's true and all. teehee...yeah anyways..."
It's almost always impossible to prove a negative. That's why the burden of proof in a debate is on the person claiming the existance of something.
"i was saying that for ppl who believe in the bible, why cant they just believe in all of it? Why do they pick and chose at what is right. why? are some things conveint to have real and some symbolic? or maybe they think that some of it isnt possible so they say its made up."
Well, you'd have to ask believers that. There are, of course, people who believe that EVERY WORD in the Bible is true (even the ridiculous parts and the parts that contradict other parts). Why they believe that, I have no idea.
"so for those of you who believe in the bible but think some of it is symbolic, why can it not all be real?"
Many parts of the Bible talk about things which are impossible, like walking on water and turning a few loaves of bread and fish into a meal for hundreds or thousands of people. Oh, there's also a guy who gets eaten by a whale (or "big fish" depending on the translation) and manages to survive. And I forgot the "turning water into wine" and "bush that burns but isn't consumed" stuff. Do you still wonder why a lot of us think that stuff isn't true? |
Scott
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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 10:20 AM
You say that the earth was created by the "Big Bang"
Prove it!
Prove it without having to hand pick the 300 or so left amino acids. |
Tyler
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:10 AM
I would like proof that God exists.
Famine, war, pestilence, greed, pain, anger, murder, suicide, homicide, poverty, hunger, genocide, pesticide(that one just belongs, don't question it or "God" will strike ye down!)
Explain to me these things, also explain to me that if God's word is final law then why are we able to change it as we see fit?
Eating meat on a Friday (which no longer truly stands)
Working on Sunday (changed to better fit society as a whole)
Also, explain to me how anyone can prove that December 25th is the date on which Jesus was born, it didn't even exist in "those days"
They would have said "What's a December?"...
And what the EFF is the deal with the Easter with the bunny and the hiding of the eggs and the kids eating chocolate?
...Ugh. |
lindsay
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:42 AM
"Many parts of the Bible talk about things which are impossible, like walking on water and turning a few loaves of bread and fish into a meal for hundreds or thousands of people. Oh, there's also a guy who gets eaten by a whale (or "big fish" depending on the translation) and manages to survive. And I forgot the "turning water into wine" and "bush that burns but isn't consumed" stuff. Do you still wonder why a lot of us think that stuff isn't true?"
cranky plz look up the defintion of God and tell me why a "god" would have limitations? i know that you dont believe in God, but pretend that you do, read that. and now youll see why it sounds rediculous. youre saying that the bible cant be true because it has things that are impossible? i think that was the point. their miracles and super natural happenings, when do occur, they arent supposed to be something that you see everyday.
tyler-
as for the date that we chose for christmas, christ wasn't born on that day. actually im pretty sure that the belief is that he was born in the spring. but if im going to say anymore about that id have to do some research..and i cant promise that i will, so you may want to take the task up yourself.
"Famine, war, pestilence, greed, pain, anger, murder, suicide, homicide, poverty, hunger, genocide, pesticide(that one just belongs, don't question it or "God" will strike ye down!)"
tyler there is a little thing called sin and freewill in the world and i believe that they would greatly encompass the reason that we have such things. think that over and then well discuss whatever problems that you have. i know that its a very common debate to say "ppl suck and so does life" so God cant be real, but i think that isnt quite good enough.
hmm i think that there was something else that i wanted to say but i cant remember it.. lol oh well
oh and carter i guess since ive been asked ill be seeing you at the sylvia page. |
Carter S
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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:44 AM
Cranky Media Guy,
"Carter, I say there are flying kangaroos on the dark side of the moon. Prove there aren't! I dare you! I believe it and that settles it."
Go ahead and think that. While you're at it say that the sun talks to you. If those are your beliefs then GREAT! You have some beliefs.
Believing in God are my beliefs.
Now by saying that, I know I am not proving that he exists. Sure I guess the Burden Of Proof is on me but I am not going to worry about it. You know why? They are my views.
Sure I can prove a negative. I did it a few entries ago. But if that person doesn't want to, then fine, they don't have to.
You see as long as someone says prove it exists I will continue to say prove it doesn't. But I could also say 'how do you know he doesn't exist', and you would say 'well because there is no proof.' then I will say 'How do you know there is no proof.' Then you will look at everything and say 'see'. and then I will look at everything and say 'see',
To me this earth is my proof.The universe is my proof.
I do know what you are talking about when you say "you cannot prove a negative" But why not.
Where in the rule books does it say that. If it were a rule I would still do it. It stops people in their tracks.
Hey, Maybe there are flying kangaroos on the dark side of the moon. Perhaps they can also be invisible. I think that your beliefs are the tops!. |
lindsay
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:53 AM
oh yeah i wanted to talk about the kangaroos.
lol well cranky before anyone can disprove your theories about the kangroos we need more info. so why do you think that there are kangraroos on the dark side of the moon? tell us a little more about them so that we can be knoweldgable enough to debate the fact.
i dont think that is a valid medaphor to our belief in God. We have communicated with God. probably millions of ppl over the years have claimed such communication, attest to his miracles, and swear by him as God. so if you have any reason to believe in such kangaroos then maybe just maybe you could use that as a medaphor. but just as a wild guess, i dont think that you do.
eric-
i agree, as ive said before in this forum theres no way for us to prove that God exist. and for many reasons. i think that humans arent smart enough, so rather than go by any mediocre logic that the world has to offer, ill go by my expiernces and instict. and actually my logic points to God. so i guess that I have good reason to believe in him. thats the problem though, until ppl have met God they wont understand that. its a personal expiernce that you must have. so i think thats our mission in life, to bring ppl to a place where they can meet God.
im really not interested in proving that God exists anymore, i will defend my belief, but if this forum is beginning to turn back to scientifically proving his existance then i may just have to say goodbye because its a huge waste of time.
hehe im hungry |
lindsay
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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:54 AM
oh haha carter already talked about the kangaroos
guess my entry was unnessacary |
Carter S
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Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:55 AM
Tyler,
When people say "oh, well why did the tsunamis hit and the hurricanes hit, go didn't save them." That's retarded. If you actually knew what people believed you find that the earth is pretty much a play ground that anything can happen. We are here to learn, and live by Gods word. Weather happens. God doesn't control the weather the earth does. or weather I don't know. People are poor because they either grew up that way or their just lazy asses. Or sometimes they are rich but something bad happens and they go poor. He God is watching carefully, seeing your reactions. You are learning. Let me repeat. LEARNING from those experiences. That's what it is all about.
Tyler, you do not have a good argument. Nice try though. |
lindsay
|
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 | 11:57 AM
oh yeah and tyler i may be stupid but i dont completely understand what ur saying with this. can you shed some light on the sentence?
"Explain to me these things, also explain to me that if God's word is final law then why are we able to change it as we see fit?"
are you talking about the way that we translate the bible? or the way that we over look God's rules and sin? |
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Note: This thread is located in the Old Forum of the Museum of Hoaxes.
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