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Matt
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Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 | 03:17 PM
I'm not sure how many people ever were certain on that. I supported the war, even though I wasn't at all convinced there was any connection between Saddam and Al-Qaeda. Here's the way I saw it.
The "connection" in my opinion was that both Saddam and the Taliban were America-hating bastards who sponsored terrorists who conducted operations against American interests. For example, Saddam Hussein sponsored an attempt to have Bush Sr. murdered, and sheltered Abu Nidal and Abu Abbas, two of the most notorious terrorists of the '80s. Ok, so they weren't on the current A-list of global bad guys. There is no way of proving whether Saddam would have sponsored something to try and top September 11th. But the facts that he did harbor terrorists, and did send them to kill Americans in the past, were no hoax at all. |
Nick
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Posted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 | 12:22 PM
i reckon there's no such thing as Iraq |
Hairy Houdini
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Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2004 | 12:46 AM
Matt, the point isn't whether Saddam hated us, and would have acted against us given the chance. The reality is, he did not, in the case of 911. As Mr. Harbison suggested, the Hoax is that the US government repeatedly and clearly claimed that Saddam had the great threat of WMDs, biological, chemical or otherwise, and was a clear and present danger, which he was not. Point- if Saddam had no WMDs as the US claimed, then they perpetrated a hoax, or (Gasp) they lied. Here's the dilly: Big Claims, no results- must be a Hoax/lie. |
Maegan
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Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 | 08:56 AM
But Saddam was still terrorizong a nation of his own people...doesn't that count for something?
Although, if we're going to start liberating dictatorships...is Cuba next?
I say we yank our support of all countries, except for those who have given us their support in the Iraq conflict. We can park some tanks at the borders to Canada & Mexico (hey, they didn't jump up to help either!) and back out of NATO. |
whatam
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Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2004 | 09:07 AM
Who said there was a connection between 7/11 & Iraq. No one I know but there were non-operational franchises before & after. And in every one of them there was a mantra performed by an owl & a chicken incessently. The owl said, "We got ice, drinks, bread, cheese". Then the chicken said, "We got meat, fish & canned peas". Then together they chanted, "From 7 to 11, from 7 to 11".
Disgusting, & I'm grateful that their regime was removed. |
Hairy Houdini
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Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2004 | 07:37 PM
yeah, removed by a hoax. The question was not whether Saddam was a jerk, but whether the reasons given for his immediate overthrow were based on falacious info. King George Himself has admitted that his intelligence was flawed. The true base question, really, is whether Bush knew the info was false, and pushed it as correct. That would constitute a hoax, no? What didn't he know and when didn't he know it? |
Velvet Greaseball
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 03:15 PM
Waaaa! Waaaa! Waaaa! [/AlGore off] |
Evildream
in You mamas house
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 06:11 PM
umm... there was no connection. the gov. never said there was....
they said he had weapons and was killing people by the thousands...
So 1 and 1/2 aint bad
He had the means but not the weapons, but he was killing people for profit. |
Evildream
in You mamas house
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 06:12 PM
oh and they have protected terrorists |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 06:24 PM
ED, my dear...
He didn't have the weapons.
Killing people for profit is not the same as killing people in their thousands (not that I'm saying he didn't).
So you get a maximum of 50%. |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 09:50 PM
isn't a hoax similar to a cover up were people say one thing when they know that in fact something else is the case. remember watergate? everyone was so surprised because their president was not just dishonest but an active participant. AND people were digging for that connection. Where are the Journos trying to prove that Georgie not only knew but probably (with his dads help) concocted half of the 'bad intelegence'. Where are the tapes the memos the proof? My belief is that the hoaxe is so enourmous this time that no one is game to look? Too embarased that they were fooled to admit it!!! Bush is the greatest hoaxer of all time. AND WE ARE HIS DUPES |
Citizen Premier
in spite of public outcry
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 | 10:12 PM
Politics may involve a lot of lies, but not hoaxes. It's simple terminology. |
sconny botland
in Scotland
Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 | 04:30 AM
I have to agree that it is a hoax but quite a sick one. The deaths in that country have not ended, the peoples lifes are not improved, the coalition's global position is not improved. It just breaks my heart that death of any human seems to justifiable.
As for repulsive goverments, there is a long long line before you reached Iraq. |
sconny botland
in Scotland
Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 | 04:31 AM
Forgot the word "be" before justifiable. |
n3
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 | 02:32 AM
You would never get a real picture here,because american people are intimidated by the recently changed laws in relation to invasion of privacy(British are going through the same thing with the ID issue).I do believe that most of people in the USA prefer not to comment on this subject. |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 | 05:25 AM
I'm not afraid to comment, and I don't feel intimidated by any laws, thank you very much! (And it's THIS attitude my British friend tells me is why so many people hate Americans - but in the same American fashion, d'ya think I <i>care</i>?) 😉
I'm not really sure what you'd like for me to prefer not to comment on. The Pres? Iraq? Our laws? Well, I didn't vote in the last election, so I really can't complain about the president. Frankly though, he's in a position that means that no matter WHAT he says or does, someone is going to disagree with him. Maybe when all this started he thought it was a good idea. Someone else must have agreed with him, b/c the president can only go to war for 90 days without the help of congress. So put THAT in your pipe and smoke it! It wasn't like he stood up in front of everyone and said, "C'mon! Just for fun...whadd'ya say?? Let's invade!" A lot of people had to agree with him before he could do it. Maybe now, it's gotten to the point where those same people are continuing the invasion in the hopes of finding something, or proving something.
I dunno...I'm not very politics-driven, and I don't really follow a lot of political news. So maybe it doesn't matter what I think...but n3, Americans are almost always happy to speak up. |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 | 04:40 PM
Now what may have happened is that Georgie Jnr says to Georgie Snr. Dady can I be JFK? Bush Snr says 'No son your too damned ugly and a republican to boot. But I will make you presedent if you do me one favour in return.....
Invade Iraq. Deal? good now if you'd just put that cocain away we can get started'.
AND YOU DIDN"T VOTE!!!!!!!! see in my country (Australia) that's against the law. |
Accipiter
Member
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Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 | 06:27 PM
Does anybody have any evidence showing that somebody in the government said that the invasion of Iraq and the terrorist attacks were actually directly linked? So far all I've seen are editorial types of comments about that, although I admit to not spending a whole lot of time looking. Most of the press releases that I've seen said that the invasion was more related to WMDs and harbouring terrorists in general. |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 | 05:21 AM
I couldn't tell ya, Acci. Like I mentioned, I didn't even pay attention. I'm just not that concerned with it. Soldiers are already in Iraq, the reasons now, are irrelevent. Although, my brother (in the USAF) will be heading over there this fall...my youngest brother (USMC) will be leaving for bootcampt about the same time - so I'm sure I'll start paying more attention...but only for their sakes.
Jamie, it's called rights. I have a right NOT to vote. And incidentally...it's not like I did it on purpose, I meant to register when I turned 18...but I worked a night shift, and slept through the day - like when I would have been up getting my forms (at that time, they were not available online). THEN, the next time around, I didn't even realize the deadline had passed. I was busy being a new mom, and hadn't even realized what was going on outside of my home. |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 | 05:17 PM
Hi Maegan,
didn't mean to be offensive, I was being a bit aggresive with my comments. I guess from a distance and particularly as a suposed key US aly. We don't get much of a feel for what is happening in peoples homes in america. are they concerned, are they actively demonstrating against the war. Or is life a larger battle. it's just such a contrast what happened 40 years ago in your country re vietnam, where the public closed down the war. (i live in the past)
Although as you say they are there now and I don't belive even John Kerry would have brought them home anyway. Good luck to your brothers. |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 12:55 AM
Maegan.
2 thumbs up.But,how do I know you are not an FBI,posing as a good guy,trying to get people into trouble.That is the real problem,because we know, we are being monitored.12 more years of this bull...,according to Secretary of Defense,will land us right into "1984". |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 01:12 AM
Maegan.
Do you even know what I've meant by saying:
"British are going through the same thing with the ID issue".(ID cards)
I watch international news.Do you?
They are going through the same thing,predicted by George Orwell.
Age of surveillance upon us. |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 02:25 AM
Theoretically we are going to have ID cards. Of course, they've been talking about it for years now and Parliament still hasn't got around to doing anything much about it... |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 03:03 AM
Boo.
I'm on your side.
But it has been a major issue on British TV last 3 days.Prove me wrong! |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 04:02 AM
Prove you wrong in what way?
It's usually a major issue. No denying that.
But we're not much further on with it than we were two years ago.
That's all I meant. |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 04:26 AM
Well.I don't live in UK.
But,if you represent Scotland Yard,then I wish you " Good Day Sir".You definitely do not belong to benevolent beings on this planet, |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 04:47 AM
Any sensitive Brit would reply differently,when G.Orwell's name would have been menchened.
Good Day Sir/Miss/Mrs Boo. |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 04:48 AM
You're a strange person, you really are.
And don't start with the whole George Orwell thing. I don't approve of ID cards, but that has nothing to do with how close they are to perhaps making some sort of law that would insist we carry them.
And I have no idea where you got the whole 'Scotland Yard' thing from. |
Smerk
in to mischief
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:01 AM
n3, even if we're not part of a government organisation, there's always someone watching what you're up to. Get over it already! |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:10 AM
Don't insault G.O., by dismissing him,like he never existed and never predicted ,what is going on right now in the world.
Have you even read the "1984" or "animal farm"? |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:14 AM
Smerk.
I find your comment very wierd!? |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:14 AM
Yes I have. Several times.
I'm not dismissing him, he just had nothing to do with what I was saying.
I shall restate it:
Yes, there are theoretically going to be ID cards (which I do not approve of). However, the plans for them are moving very slowly.
Whether or not it is in the manner of Big Brother is irrelevant to my post. |
LaMa
in Europe
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:16 AM
n3, I've read both. But what makes you think '1984' was a prediction? It was merely a warning, and related to 1948 (1984 is just the revrsal of the last two digits of that year). It was concern whether the world, in the aftermath of the war, would really turn to democracy again, instead of being run by the military. |
Smerk
in to mischief
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:16 AM
Really? I though it made perfect sense. |
LaMa
in Europe
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:18 AM
We have to carry ID's here in the Netherlands since recent. I don't care. |
MI 5
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:22 AM
Allright n3, we've traced your IP and got you surrounded. Resistance is futile. Come out with your hands above your head.... |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:22 AM
Well, Jamie...what is going on in my home is that I'm struggling to raise a child with my husband. We're barely make enough to survive on & can't afford to live in the town where I grew up. I worry about my brothers, but other than that - the war is happening and it doesn't consume my life. I wish there wasn't a war, but it's not any reason to spit on soldiers or not support my brothers in what they do. Heck if my brothers had been bums, I'd still support their desire to just sit around.
n3 - I dunno how you'd know I wasn't an FBI agent. I do live & work very closely to MacDill AirForce Base. So I COULD be a spook, as I've got the means. But seriously - I'm much too busy having a mediocre job with nice benefits to be in the FBI. I just haven't the time.
I don't watch international news, unless pausing on BBC world news b/c I like the accents counts. I spend a few minuts on the local news at night - long enough to see what tomorrow's rain chances are and if the Interstate will be blocked. (Although, I don't use the interstate to get to work - I just like to know that IF I have to use it, I can.)
And I'm not sure what ID thingies you're talking about. But most everyone in the U.S. has some sort of I.D. Most I.D.s are just driver's licenses, or military I.D.s, but you can get a state issued I.D. card, this way if you don't drive you can still buy beer or cigarettes, or see an R rated movie, or buy porn stuffs. Well, assuming you look old enough you don't need an I.D., but it helps. |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:34 AM
Um, n3, what makes you so special that you think the government wants to watch you all the time? |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:39 AM
Sorry,Meagan.ID cards is British thing.
My apologies. |
n3
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 05:46 AM
M.
I would just feel better,when I know,that I have all those freedoms,which I may never use.
But it's nice to know,that they are still out there. |
Boo
in The Land of the Haggii...
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:05 AM
Well, since we don't actually have ID cards here, but LaMa does, I'd call it a Dutch thing, actually. |
agent CIA 27453
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:10 AM
n3, you still didn't come out with your hands above your head...
We've traced you. You are in Plano, Texas.
Look out of the window. Yes, that's us....
Resistance is futile. Just come out, and we'll have a talk.... |
agent CIA 27453
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:12 AM
Don't make this into a new Waco, n3....just come out. You're surrounded, there is nowhere you can go. |
LaMa
in Europe
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:36 AM
I always have an ID with me Boo, but have never been asked for it.
Like in Britain they tried to introduce it here for years, but many people resisted, with memories of WWII "ausweis".
But recently it was decided and implemented nevertheless. |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:54 AM
I don't see the big deal. There have been I.D.s here or years.
Anywho...This is moving off-topic. Hows about a nice talk about war? |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 | 06:13 PM
I think actual war is something that no one knows anything about until it actually touches you or your family. I think my key question is -is there anything that is positive about war? I know James Brown said it first but i don't think anybody came up with an answer. It's good for keeping oil reserves secure and politicians in office. Anything else. |
LaMa
in Europe
Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 | 12:12 AM
Being a second generation war victim, I should say there is little positive about war.... |
Charybdis
in Hell
Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 | 08:32 AM
That doesn't alter the fact that, hideous as it is, war is sometimes a necessity. Either to protect yourself or others.
But I am in NO way saying that our current war compares with WWII, so don't even go there. |
Maegan
in Tampa, FL - USA
Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 | 09:20 AM
::snaps fingers:: That's right, don't go there!
😉
Sure, war is good for thinning out the population...?? :roll: |
David
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 | 09:50 AM
Here's your hoax...
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/lieofthecentury.html
Just click it and read. perhaps it'll open some eyes. |
E.D.
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 | 10:12 PM
well.. boo if i had apple seeds could you not infer that i could make apples? and could you not infer that since i have the seeds that i might also have grown the apples? Well if you didnt stop me and my apples of mass distruction i could kill thousands of people with my AMDs.
(saddom did kill people for profit but he still killed them)
sorry if this seems off topic i was responding to an earlier post. |
sconny botland
in Scotland
Member
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 | 07:16 AM
Question-How did the coalition know that Iraq had WMD?
Answer- They checked their receipts |
MovieLover
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Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2005 | 12:57 AM
A comment on Spielberg's War of the Worlds:
"It's certainly about Americans fleeing for their lives, being attacked for no reason, having no idea why they are being attacked and who is attacking them," says Spielberg.
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050627/film_nm/leisure_warofworlds_dc
The commercial sounds like this:This is not a war,this is an extermination.
The country,that was chosen for the prewew of his movie was Japan.
Why Japan?
And just think,how people of Afganistan and Iraq would see this movie.
A far superior nation attacking a little country,living in Stone Age.
Spielberg is no Tarkovsky,but is he trying to send a message here in the times of uncertainties.Something like:We are the invaders. |
A.B.
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Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 | 08:29 PM
"Ever notice how, with the left, it's always described as "American unease", then they point around the globe and tell us how uneasy every other country is at our response. When Spielberg says "American uneasiness", he's the uneasy American. I don't know why though".
http://dougpowers.blogspot.com/2005/06/spielbergs-war-of-worlds-statement-on.html |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2005 | 09:36 PM
I wonder if Steven 'ET' Spielberg pictures his own country being over run by aliens (read muslin hoards). OR is he actually saying this is what it looks like right NOW in a far east country (read iraq) for the poor innocent people we are slaughtering and we should stop doing it.... ?
is he saying he relates to the 'victims' of US attacks. OR is he saying he's afraid of being attacked? and relates to the terror felt inside the US?
Or is he saying whatever the stuff he can think of to get people into the movie... |
Accipiter
Member
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 | 01:05 AM
Um, you people do realize that "The War of the Worlds" was written in the 19th century, not just recently by Stephen Spielberg, don't you? |
Jamie Forsberg
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 | 04:59 PM
where did I say it wasn't dude? I was talking about how it's being presented as 'relevant' today.... If he hadn't made that 9/11 comment I would have gone oh well just another remake from hollywood, land of no (original) ideas...... |
Dude
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Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 | 08:29 PM
War is a necessity, as Char said. Yes it |
LaMa
in Europe
Member
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Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 | 02:09 AM
Can |
Chuck
in Rhode Island
Member
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Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 | 07:15 AM
i dont have anything constructive to add to the discussion but was reading through the thread and was struck by something hairy had said....
"King George Himself has admitted that his intelligence was flawed"
dont know if the double entendre was intended or not but man, hairy, that made me laugh and laugh and laugh 😊
and lama, many americans have the very same problem with "our" foreign policy...it's not something reserved for non-americans...and let me apologize in advance, after typing that, i can see how it might come off as kinda rude, not my intention, just making a statement 😊 |
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