Status: urban legends
An article from the Philippine Daily Inquirer records some Philippine urban legends: the "White Lady" of Balete Drive, Robina Gokongwei's "snake twin" lurking in department store dressing rooms, the elusive "kapre" that lives in an ancient mango tree near the Emilio Aguinaldo house in Kawit town, and Andres Bonifacio's love child from a place aptly named Libog (now Santo Domingo) in Albay province. None of those mean much to me. But most of the article is devoted to discussing two other Philippine legends that are of more general interest. The first one is that Jose Rizal, the national hero of the Philippines,
"was the father of Adolf Hitler, the result of an indiscretion with a prostitute in Vienna." The second one is that Jose Rizal was also Jack the Ripper:
Rizal was in London from May 1888 to January 1889, in the British Library copying "Sucesos de las islas Filipinas" by hand because there were no photocopying machines at the time. Jack the Ripper was active around this time, and since we do not know what Rizal did at night or on the days he was not
in the library, some people would like to believe Rizal is suspect. They argue that when Rizal left London, the Ripper murders stopped. They say that Jack the Ripper must have had some medical training, based on the way his victims were mutilated. Rizal, of course, was a doctor. Jack the Ripper liked women, and so did our own Rizal. And -- this is so obvious that many overlooked it -- Jose Rizal's initials match those of Jack the Ripper!
If Jack the Ripper did turn out to be Filipino, that would throw a wrench in his status as the
Most Evil Brit of all time.
Related Posts:
Nov 9, 2005:
Japanese Urban Legends
Oct 14, 2004:
Iraqi Urban Legends
Comments
i'm gonna have to agree. just think the crusades.
And I hit on something good when I least expected it..serendi-- what do you call that now?
Postings from eon, concerned Filipino, and Davis have me in stitches. You guys are something. Really. Insults galore. Streaks of brilliance. Humor without intent.History. Tsismis.
This is better than Discovery Channel andNational Geographic combined.
Keep it up guys!
Yes, I enjoyed your banter with Filipino- but only to a point.
Perhaps you guys might want to get back to the subject of Rizal- Did he or didn' he? How did you guys know Jack the R. was a mason? If Jack the R. was a mason, then that rules out women as possible perpetrators because you could not be a mason if you are a woman, right?
Then after some substantial diccussion, you can get right back to firing away at each other and tearing your guts out.
We'd still be in the sidelines-LOL.
As far as Jack being a mason, there are many sites claiming he was. A site you can find such information is http://freemasonrywatch.org/jacktheripper.html
Though I don't condone those sites as a petitioner. It might have slight "truths" in them. As you already know, I believe in hearing everyone's side of the story. The movie "From Hell" points to a masonic conspiracy. Although, the worshipful master(head of the lodge - usually takes at least 12 years to achieve) of the lodge by me, told me that based on his studies, he believes Jack the Ripper was a mason and the masonic timing of everything was just a coincidence. I'll gather more information.
What is that?
Pray ask your WM friend to enlighten us further.
BTW eon, I admire young men who are "working" on certain perceived inadequacies.
And I am not patronizing you, Ok?
Now you go and seek out your WM friend and tell us about what he has to say about masonic timings.
BTW, again. I have been told that 'high noon' is significant to masons. But J the R killed {prowled?} at night. I am told also that lodge meetings are usually late afternoons. So maybe J the R sought out low flying palomas after attending lodge meetings?
Eon, I think your WM friend will have to tell you a lot more if we are to attach some masonic
ties to our 100-year old mystery.
http://www.goodmorals.org/mormons/index.asp?poetlist=ChapterTwo.htm
"The Entered Apprentice's penalty for disclosing his secret grip is to have "the throat cut across from ear to ear, the tongue torn out by the roots, and the body buried up to the neck below the high tide line."
It states the other penalties for other degrees as well. I believe mary kelly suffered most of these penalties according to the autopsy reports.
I was told that in these times masonry is not as severe as before. Those were penalties for betraying such an elite group at the time. Now the society is open to those who inquire.
btw, thanks, knowing the problem is the first step. one of the masonic mottos are..."...make a good man a
Interesting. Perhaps Jack the Ripper was a mormon? If he was, Jose Rizal (not a mormon)should be off the hook.
Maybe a new thread on this possibility?
Curiouser and curiouser, eh?
http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/35899
according to this, it was indeed copied from the masons as joseph smith was a mason(translator)
none the less, it is still possible that the perpetrator was a mormon.
I will look more into the actual murders and see if it has anymore masonic meaning. If it has more masonic meaning that mormonistic.
On a side note though...freemasonry was not as wide spread as it is today. It was much more elite. It is possible that these were the consequences for betraying or illegaly acquiring the secrets of the masons. I was told by a mason that during the 1920s...if you wore a ring and were unable to defend it against questioning, your finger bearing the ring will be cutoff on the spot...not really relevant but it shows the seriousness of their members in the past in the matters of secrecy and honor.
So, since all you've done is make allegations based on circumstantial evidence, and you haven't actually proven anything, pretty much all I'm doing here is responding to your personal attacks. Since you've been reduced to making off-topic aspersions on how rich I am, I don't actually have to hang around here any longer; you know that. It's already obvious I've won anyway. So maybe I'll humor you a little while longer, maybe not.
First, you think money is important, you materialistic little boy? I don't think so. And for you to say I don't because I don't have it is completely illogical and well within your character. (You're going to defend yourself by saying you just said that to mock me. And what if I say that mocking others is wrong? What then?) Money is a man-made construct, you idiot; it doesn't even have any value beyond what we attach to it. They're just slips of paper! A person's character is more important than how rich he is, but you wouldn't understand that, now would you?
Second, I've had my doubts about whether you're even actually a Filipino from the start, since racists have been known to impersonate Filipinos, but if you are, it's better that you leave here. We don't need people like you here.
Third: You think you're superior to me? Well, you thought wrong. I too, don't think I'm superior to others, but I KNOW that I'm superior to you.
Four: YOU'RE actually lecturing ME about assuming things!? You're the one who assumed I'm poor and don't have home Internet access, you degenerate. Don't you think that's a little hypocritical, even for you?
Five: Yes, that's my policy. You don't like it? Then why did you start name-calling me? You think you can do things and others can't, you conceited little boy?
You know, one of the really amusing things about you is how you think I'm a hypocrite for calling you a name caller while I also do it, while ignoring the greater sin - you STARTED the name-calling. Now why would that be, you think? I'd like to see you slither out of this one, like the snake that you are.
Seven: It is, or should be. Your point being...?
Eight: I could say that, but then I'd be lying. And remind me again why I have to give any of my personal details to you, an insignificant civilian who doesn't have any authority whatsoever over me? And while you're at it, could you explain what my Internet access has to do with the topic? And please answer this one, I know you ignore questions that you can't answer, so I'm making sure you don't have that convenient option available to you.
There's a perfectly valid reason for my taking a long time to reply, but I am under no compulsion to explain it to a nobody like you. Suffice it to say that I have limited Internet time (but not because I go to a cafe) and frankly, I can think of a lot of better things to do with that time than talk to an attention-starved loser like you.
Excuses? Like what? You know, I noticed another of your tactics: you try to provoke me, then when I respond, you say I'm on the defensive. Why don't you go back to grade school, your mind's still at that level.
Nine: So they did. Which proves what, exactly?
I might remind you that some people have insulted you too. I suppose this is yet another example of how you ignore facts that don't agree with your case.
And about keeping an open mind? I've thought seriously about this, and I've concluded that Rizal is not Jack the Ripper. It's not within his character, and there is NO actual evidence. You're confusing open-mindedness with lunacy.
Ten: I've also thought about this, and I've decided that you're the one who doesn't know the meaning of suspect, or hypocrite for that matter. However, you have yet to be enlightened. And stop mentioning the others, you only mention them when they support you, isn't that unfair?
You pointed it out? Others pointed it out? Did you not see my response, you immoral bastard? Or are you ignoring it in the hopes that I won't remember, since you can't answer. I said: I'm not a hypocrite because it's my policy to insult back when others insult me first. If they don't, then I don't. I think that's fair. You are a hypocrite because you have the nerve to criticize me for name-calling when you started it in the first place. How dare you. This is the fourth or so time I've said this, and you have not yet been unable to respond. Now who lost? :D
"As for "not answering your questions""
Here's a thought: Why don't you just go and give an example instead of going into all these contortions? It's getting painful to watch. What's that? You can't?
And you still, after I asked you twice, haven't explained how you can say you don't take anything as a fact, and in the same breath, say you showed me facts. I demand an answer, so you can embarrass yourself further.
And you still haven't explained how you can deny that you're a hypocrite, and even worse that that, call me a hypocrite, I already explained my policy, and you're clearly at fault for starting the name-calling. I hope you'll stop evading the issue, as is your wont, and answer this.
And you still haven't explained to me how you can call yourself someone skilled in the field of debate, or say you're carrying on a serious discussion, when you keep resorting to personal attacks. I know why I'm doing it - it's in response to yours. What's your excuse? s it because you think there's nothing wrong with "mocking" others? Is it because you don't realize it's not even related to the topic, and you're making one fallacy after another? Is it because you're desperate and have nothing else to say, but you have to respond or else you'll be humiliated? Is it because you got so "pikon" from my arguments that you lost control? Yeah, that must be it. Why don't you just admit it? Admit you lost. Admit you were trying to provoke me into a flame war, since that's all you're good at? Admit you're just trolling?
I'm waiting.
"I own you"
looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool
you do though
Can't your brain cells serve you better? What a pathetic scheme ALEX!
Could Rizal harbour an anger against prostitutes due to a personal experience that damaged him physically and emotionally?
Those are all speculations which is in no way sufficient for a conclussion but taken together with other facts could be intriguing on this issue.
The masses continue to swallow the crap that they are fed. Fanatics who believe that such a great man cannot do wrong.
Jose Rizal was a great man and as noble as he was, he was still human. He was still subject to flaws and misjudgments. Understand that all great leaders has their ups and their downs. They were ambiguous. Not even Gandhi was a 100% saint.
I entreat you to open your mind and eyes and see what is beyond the veil that has been put before us!
A time will come when we will use our brains once again.
The famous letter you keep harping on about is the Lusk letter, isn't it? That's the one that came with a kidney(it's not even 100% sure that the kidney was human). Well, eon, the letter's written in English, not Spanish, and there is nothing in it at all that would point to Jose Rizal more than any other person. The other half of the kidney was never found anywhere, let alone linked to Rizal.
Well, there goes eon's idiotic little argument. My advice to you is, if you want to troll around a little with absurd accusations, then make up something more convincing, okay? 😊
There you go again assuming and claiming like you know it all. This my friend is your problem. You simulate perspicacity so that we, the people, don't see how idiotic you are.
1. No it's not the Lusk Letter so your whole argument is null and void. LEARN TO READ!
2. Even if it was the Lusk Letter, that's just one point of my argument. The rest remains.
3. My philosophy is still this - I make no claims, just theories.
4. After one whole year you come back with your neophetic research. Also, You were thinking about how to get back at me for one full year!!!
and Of course...to no avail.
My advice to you is this...don't speak. The less you do, the smarter you SEEM to be.
"upon further investigation...this information was found...similarities noting the f's
how interesting."
The two links shown are in Spanish. You probably hoped no one here could read Spanish. Unfortunately for you... The first link is a paper of the La Liga Filipina, the civic association he founded. The second link is his final poem, Mi Ultimo Adios.
How interesting indeed.
You FOB, did you really think you'd fool anyone with such a stupid little trick? You probably thought you were so smart, didn't you? Well, looks as though the game's up, FOB. There you go, with all your "theories", all your high-and-mighty posing.
No wonder you were saying "even if it was the Lusk letter". You probably don't even know what the Lusk letter is, and you were getting worried I'd find out.
My advice to you is this...don't speak. The less you do, the smarter you
SEEM to be.
I don't know who to pity...you for lacking the mental capacity for a rebuttal or me, for entertaining such an asinine fool.
1. I actually speak Spanish and it doesn't matter what language his writings are in you fool. They are still his writings. Those writings are meant to be compared with the RIPPER letters. Hence the reason I asked to look at the similarities. I feel as if I'm arguing with a little boy.
2. You insult other readers by telling them it's in Spanish. I think it's pretty clear that it is NOT in English nor is it in Tagalog. Jack the Ripper wrote in English. I think it's pretty obvious that those writings are not Jack The Ripper's. You are the fool for assuming that one is Jack the Ripper's and the other Jose Rizal's.
3. I said "Even if it was the Lusk Letter" to prove to you that it's only one part of my argument. I didn't say it was the Lusk Letter. Again, you take words out of context. I'm afraid you'll have to practice English more. Your reading comprehension skills are, shall we say, sub par. Go to like Embassy or something and talk to the posers over there to hone your skills. Your "BOOK" English is simply insufficient.
4. Oh yes...now I'm a FOB.
Once again, you have replied and have produced nothing. The only thing different this time is that you called me a FOB. Is that a new word for you? Has it just reached the Philippines? You must think you're cool for using that new hip word. My sole income surpasses that of your whole clan combined. I doubt a poor boy like yourself who has to go to an internet cafe to reply to my posts has any right to call anyone a FOB.
Have you even stepped out of the Philippines little man? ` Know your place, boy.
It would be more noble of you to admit defeat. You try so hard...but to no avail.
My advice to you...
"If you dissemble sometimes your knowledge of that you are thought to know, you shall be thought another time to know that you know not." - SFB
There's just one little problem with your otherwise good argument, FOB.
"upon further investigation...this information was found...similarities noting the f's"
Right after this line of yours are the two links, indicating that those two links are the "information".
So we'll suspect Rizal know because his handwriting looks like the Ripper's? Comparing handwriting is very inexact, so it's pointless to compare. Also, the Ripper letters may have been written by different people. For the record, his handwriting doesn't look the same to me.
3. "Go to like Embassy" You really amuse me with your grammar.
4. "My sole income surpasses that of your whole clan combined. I doubt a poor boy like yourself who has to go to an internet
cafe to reply to my posts has any right to call anyone a FOB."
Aw, you're hurt, you widdle FOB you? How do you know my clan's income or whether I go to Internet cafes? Oh, wait, it's more of your usual irrelevant personal attacks, without regard for whether what you say is true or not. I thought you placed high value on factual validity?
Even though you're losing, you should stay on topic and avoid fallacies of irrelevance. Ya dig, FOB?
"Know your place, boy."
Ooh, I'm shaking, FOB. You're just a second-class citizen in the US and already you're trying-hard to imitate their arrogance. It's so pathetic.
By the way, did you see this comment?
"Hello
This is new information to us, that Filipino physician Dr. Jose Rizal has been considered to be Jack the Ripper by anybody. There is, as stated, no evidence to prove that he was other than he was in London at the time, which seems to be manifestly weak evidence.
Christopher T. George
Editor, Ripperologist"
That's a Ripperologist already. Since you, you know, like to show how you use expert opinions as sources.
Give it up already. Your comments have degenerated to nothing but defensive flaming.
"So we'll suspect Rizal know because his handwriting looks like the Ripper's? Comparing handwriting is very inexact, so it's pointless to compare." - Oh I'm sure you're right there! Why don't we just get rid of forensics altogether? It's preposterous for an idiot like you to discredit handwriting analysis. Do you truly believe you are qualified to make that claim?
"So we'll suspect Rizal know because..." I believe what you are trying to say is, "So we'll suspect Rizal NOW because..." I am correct once more...I have proven your book English is lacking. You had a few days to revise your reply and you still failed.
Now that I've pointed out your fault, I can answer that question. I present the information, I leave the implications to the masses.
"'Go to like Embassy' You really amuse me with your grammar." - Apparently I wrote that to sound snotty. It's not like me to even sound like that. My mistake would be in assuming you would learn to stop taking things out of context and learn to "read between the lines."
"Aw, you're hurt, you widdle FOB you..."
As for your whole statement there, you've already been caught lying before...I know you are poor. The fact that you simulate erudition(defense) and you don't have immediate internet access.
"By the way, did you see this comment?..."
Yes I saw it. It is but one person's opinion. I have my own. I consider his could be right, and it may also be wrong.
"Even though you're losing." hahaha!
1. Everything you bring up, I destroy. I've pointed out your shortcomings...now you are just grasping. You have nothing.
2. You're on the attack. You're attacking ideas I set forth a year ago. If I'm losing, then why are you losing sleep? For argument's sake(I'm not saying this is true...it's hypothetical. I'm stating this because you have a history of taking things out of context), If you won, why, after a year, would you come back to beat me even more lol? Only the worst type of animal prey upon the fallen yes?
Unfortunately, your actions are not because you are a scavenger. You are on the attack because you want to redeem yourself and one only redeems themselves when they feel lowly. Why don't you read what others think about you? People in the Philippines are telling you to shut up...even with my conceit and arrogant bravado.
Love it when the canonical value of histories and its figures is put to question.
A non-linear reading of the Spanish-Filipino relations in the 1800's reveals a different story from what is written in Philippine textbooks.
There is a different story to Rizal that is left unpublished.
It's like Shakspeare and Sir Francis Bacon.
We, as human's are flawed. No one is perfect. A Hero can do wrong. A genius could be chemically imbalanced. This is nature.
Even Alexander the Great slaughtered hundreds of thousands of mercenaries when he didn't have to(he had already won the battle). Yet without Alexander would our world be the way it is today? He expanded to most of the known world and promoted the toleration of other cultures. How could a man who believes in the good of humanity kill hundreds of thousands of people?
The world must understand the ambiguous nature of man.
...i don't think you can differentiate a THEORY froma FACT...even a grade 3 student knows that!!!if you don't beleive it...just shut up!!!!who cares anyway...this is only for people who are open minded!!!and i am so sure you are not one of them!!!!.......grow up will you!!!!!!!!
....dahhhhhhh......
>embecile
>idiot
>moron
>stupid
>hipocrite
>FOB
....are you describing yourself concerned filipino????....
...kidstuff.......
One of the many Freemasonic mottos is, "Ordo Ab Chao" meaning, Order out of Chaos. From these killings came order and the cleansing of the filth that existed in Whitechapel.
If you've read Rizal's works you could see his "means to an end" attitude...which was great! It's what made his novels so intriguing haha. His reference to the writing on the wall was well done!
Of course there's a theory about Jose Rizal being Jack the Ripper. Only thing is, it hasn't been proved. As such, it is not yet a fact, as even you said. Common sense would dictate that until it is proven that Jose Rizal was Jack the Ripper, we'll assume he wasn't. I was arguing against it. That is my right in a free country, just as it is the right of certain attention whores to insult historical figures with bizarre conspiracy theories. Why so defensive? Is it because you know how silly your "theory" sounds? You know, if you had more confidence in this theory, you wouldn't have to take it so personally. Have more confidence people!
The fact is, eon and zwicky szahsz (who are probably the same person anyway) are being disingenuous. They keep saying it's a theory, and then speak of it as if it were fact. The question I've repeatedly asked eon, which he continues to evade, is whether he himself believes it or not. Answering "It's a theory" is mere evasion. What does he really think?
I wonder why eon argues so strongly for this "theory", while refusing to state directly that he believes it? Could it be because he knows how stupid it is? If he really believed it, he would say so. I've never heard of a thinker who developed a theory he didn't believe in. When Newton devised the Theory of Gravity, he didn't not believe in it. Just a thought 😊
Due to this fact, people had now seen the terrible living conditions that these men, women, and children were exposed to, and thus leading to a reformation."
Talk about innuendo taken to the next level. XD
Now you are the one believing in conspiracy theories...thinking that there is a conspiracy out there to kick you when you're down. Unfortunately, you are mistaken. I am not the one who, after a year, rekindles this old flame of ours with another rant haha. I've stated this already.
"They keep saying it's a theory, and then speak of it as if it were fact. The question "I've repeatedly asked eon, which he continues to evade, is whether he himself believes it or not. Answering "It's a theory" is mere evasion. What does he really think?
I wonder why eon argues so strongly for this "theory", while refusing to state directly that he believes it? Could it be because he knows how stupid it is? If he really believed it, he would say so. I've never heard of a thinker who developed a theory he didn't believe in. When Newton devised the Theory of Gravity, he didn't not believe in it. Just a thought grin"
LOL! So your argument is that one must believe in a theory for it to be factual? I can theorize that there is a God, but must I believe in the theory for God to actually exist? As I've stated before, your reasoning is flawed. Two rhetorical questions to debunk your entire statement.
Concerned, you live in a finite world, whilst I live in an infinite world and because of this, you will always be limited - in all that you do. Oscar Wilde once wrote, "To define is to limit."
"I am not the one who, after a year, rekindles this old flame of ours with another rant haha. I've stated this already."
And then you keep responding right? What a hypocrite you are. By the way, the one who's ranting is not me but your sock puppet back there. With grammar like his...well what can I say, birds of a feather flock together. XD
"So your argument is that one must believe in a theory for it to be factual?"
No, you moron. I'm asking you whether you yourself believe in this theory or not. Are you sure you've graduated from grade school? Your grasp of basic English doesn't seem to be all that good. Perhaps it's due to being a FOB. :=D
"I can theorize that there is a God, but must I believe in the theory for God to actually exist?"
This argument is yet another attempt at evasion. You're saying that if something is true, it is whether or not people believe in it (and vice-versa). I agree, and that's why Rizal was not Jack the Ripper no matter how much you think he was. 😊
"Concerned, you live in a finite world, whilst I live in an infinite world and because of this, you will always be limited - in all that you do. Oscar Wilde once wrote, "To define is to limit."'
There's only one word to describe the above - hubris. I really pity you.
eon, what you call an "infinite world," the rest of the real world calls "profound detachment from reality." I do live in a finite world. And so do you. I advise you to get your head checked.
And while you're at it, quit quoting greater men to make yourself appear more intelligent. It's really pathetic.
I've already proved my point anyway. I have no problem with theories. I just don't believe in this one, because your evidence is sorely lacking. I was just concerned by your seeming inability to distinguish theory from fact. Now that you yourself are (finally) admitting that this is not a fact, then there's no problem.
Anyone has the right to make up "theories" about the JFK assassination, pyramid power, and so on. No one's stopping you from making a fool of yourself, if that's your concern.
No it doesn't take two to beat you. It takes an iota of my intelligence to do so. I have done this already. People come across this site and see that you are so pathetic that they must comment on your stupidity.
"And then you keep responding right? What a hypocrite you are."
No fool, I am not a hypocrite because I did not start the argument again after a 1 year hiatus. You still don't know what hypocrite means!
"'So your argument is that one must believe in a theory for it to be factual?'
'No, you moron. I'm asking you whether you yourself believe in this theory or not.'"
Moron, it's a response to your previous remark, "When Newton devised the Theory of Gravity, he didn't not believe in it." Wow, you are truly an idiot.
"'I can theorize that there is a God, but must I believe in the theory for God to actually exist?'
'This argument is yet another attempt at evasion. You're saying that if something is true, it is whether or not people believe in it (and vice-versa). I agree, and that's why Rizal was not Jack the Ripper no matter how much you think he was. grin'"
It's apparent that you do not and cannot grasp the English language well. I simply stated that regardless of who believes in the theory of a God, if it exists, it exists.
In a way Concerned Filipino, I admire your persistence. However, your foundation and objective are way off. You try to be smart by using bigger words than you are normally accustomed to, but the problem is, you use them incorrectly or you don't understand what they truly mean. Stick to words you are familiar with.
A quote by Sir Francis Bacon would well accompany my thesis, "If you dissemble sometimes your knowledge of that you are thought to know, you shall be thought another time to know that you know not."
I quote writers and philosophers because it is relevant and adds to the strength of my argument. It's not to show you how perspicacious I am. By you asking me to stop quoting people, you show your insecurity and your low self-esteem.
About me being an American Citizen...I'm sorry I can travel almost anywhere in the world with a blue passport? I mean, I just came back from Europe with little effort...that can't possibly be a negative thing.
I take pride in all that I do. I wouldn't have any heart if I wasn't proud of what I did. If I didn't, I'd be like you. I'd be insecure.
...i believe making a theory doesn't make you a fool....
LOL...really funny...
eon is only stating a theory. he doesn't have to believe it. he's simply stating it.
concerned filipino is obviously proud to be a filipino and because of this, s/he is against anyone who may have an inkling of destroying a reputation of the nation's known hero.
both of you are obviously smart people. it's just sad that instead of merely attacking the other person's opinion, you two have ended up attacking each other as a person.