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Vaccination myths?
Posted: 06 November 2008 04:03 AM
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http://www.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/family/11/05/par.vaccine.kids/index.html

Vaccines: Separating fact from fiction

When Katie Shutters’s 13-month-old daughter, Averie, was born, she followed the recommended vaccine schedule for two months. Then she did some research and decided to hold off on additional shots until Averie turned 9 months old. “I liked the idea of my breast milk giving her the immunities she needs and allowing her body to work for her instead of some medicine,” says the stay-at-home mom from Indianapolis, Indiana. “She isn’t in daycare, and we don’t travel overseas. I had concerns about injecting her for no reason.”

Eventually Shutters found a doctor who would immunize according to her schedule: “We broke up the MMR [which protects against measles, mumps, and rubella] into three separate shots spread out over a year, and we’re skipping the chicken pox shot,” she says. “Instead, I’d love to find a kid who has chicken pox so we could expose Averie naturally.”

If Shutters’s approach to vaccination sounds familiar, that’s because it is. In fact, most moms don’t have to look far beyond their circle of friends to find a family with serious concerns. It’s not difficult to understand why. For one, it can be torture to watch your child get jabbed repeatedly with a needle. Combine that discomfort with a steady stream of negative publicity—celebrity diatribes, alarmist news and Internet reports, ripped-from-the-headline TV shows—and the wariness seems warranted.

Yet underneath all the debate and impossibly good intentions (after all, everyone hopes to be doing the best for their child no matter how or whether they immunize), there are some solid facts about the benefits of shots that cannot be ignored. “We live thirty years longer now than we did a century ago, thanks to purified water—and vaccines,” says Paul Offit, M.D., chief of infectious diseases at the Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia in Pennsylvania.

But as soon as compliance wanes, the protection we have against many devastating, and sometimes fatal, diseases wanes right along with it. This year’s measles outbreak—the biggest in nearly a decade—may be the first warning shot, says Dr. Offit. Nearly all of the 131 people affected so far, many of them children, were purposely not vaccinated against the disease, according to a new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), in Atlanta, Georgia.

“We have to take this seriously,” says Anne Schuchat, M.D., director of the CDC National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “I do not want to see the day where thousands of kids get this disease and die when we have the tools to prevent it.”

So what’s a worried mom to do? Between the scary claims about shots themselves and the scary news about what can happen without them, you might feel like you need a Ph.D. in immunology, toxicology, and biostatistics to make sense of it all. To help, Parenting.com has highlighted four of the concerns heard regularly, and dug through the science to get the facts. The bottom line: No medical intervention is 100 percent risk-free, and no one but you can choose what’s right for your child. Our job is to help that decision come a little easier, so here goes:

The worry: Vaccines cause autism

What’s behind it: This claim first came to the forefront in 1998, after a British study linked the MMR vaccine to 12 children with autism. Prior to this, there had been some concern that thimerosal, a mercury-based preservative common in many vaccines at the time, also may have been partly or totally to blame for some cases of autism.

The facts: So far, ten studies involving thousands of children have failed to find any connection between the MMR and autism. Plus, the original paper suggesting a connection between the two was formally retracted by 10 of its 13 authors in 2004.

As for the thimerosal issue, there’s a bit more backstory worth explaining: First, it’s absolutely true that mercury can be harmful. The kind in contaminated fish and water builds up in the body when ingested and can cause severe nerve damage. However, the type of mercury that’s in thimerosal doesn’t accumulate in the body. “It’s never been linked to any adverse effect,” says William Schaffner, M.D., professor of preventive medicine at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, in Nashville, Tennessee.

Plus, autism rates have continued to rise even after drug companies voluntarily phased out the preservative from all vaccines given to kids (with the exception of some flu shots) in 2001. Clearly, we are far from understanding everything we need to about the range of autistic disorders. And that’s why “the possible link between vaccines and autism has been taken very seriously,” says Dr. Schuchat. “But at this point, after so many studies, it’s safe to say these two hypotheses have been eliminated as possible causes.”

*** continued below ***

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Posted: 06 November 2008 04:03 AM   [ # 1 ]
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*** continued from above ***

The worry: Too many shots too soon is risky

What’s behind it: Late last year, the parents of 9-year-old Hannah Poling won a lawsuit in which they claimed that their daughter’s autism had been triggered by the five “catch-up” shots for nine diseases she received in one day. She got the injections in 2000, when she was 19 months old. The highly publicized case underscored fears—also raised by actress Jenny McCarthy, who has a son she believes has recovered from autism—that the practice of giving multiple vaccines at once is too much for a small child’s body to handle.

The facts: Hannah Poling was born with a disorder that affects her mitochondria (the structures within cells that produce energy). And though the family won the settlement on the theory that this underlying vulnerability could have made her more susceptible to vaccine injury, there’s actually no proof that she—or any other child with mitochondrial disease—was in fact at any increased risk, says neurologist John Shoffner, M.D., associate professor of biology at Georgia State University, in Atlanta, Georgia, one of the doctors who diagnosed Hannah’s disorder.

“There is no evidence that the contents of vaccines are the cause of autism or mitochondrial disorders,” he says. What’s more, because even common illnesses like colds, the flu, and rotavirus can cause significant harm to these children, doctors strongly advise they receive all the recommended shots.

So what does all of this mean for parents of healthy kids? Not much—getting more than one shot at a time isn’t the huge physical stress it seems to be. Their immune systems handle far greater challenges from everyday exposure to germs on shared toys, doorknobs, and the playroom floor.

As Dr. Offit explains it: Think about the bugs that caused your child’s last ear infection. Each single bacterium has 2,000 to 3,000 components that stimulate an immune response from the body. As those bacteria multiply, the challenge to the immune system increases exponentially. Your baby feels awful and likely has a high fever and lots of pain. The body pulls out the stops to fight it off. Now compare that to this: “The entire fourteen-shot course of childhood vaccinations contains only about 150 immunological components altogether,” says Dr. Offit. This is about a tenth of the challenge posed by exposure to just one microscopic germ.

What’s more, the bacteria and viruses used in vaccines are either killed or altered, says Martin Myers, M.D., author of “Do Vaccines Cause That?!” There are just enough to induce immunity, but not enough to make someone sick—and certainly not enough to overload the immune system of a healthy child. As with any medical intervention, side effects, including soreness, rashes, and fever, are possible, but most are mild and short-lived. In rare instances, some children experience fever-induced seizures following shots, but though these are frightening, they cause no permanent harm.

One common response to these concerns is to break up combination vaccines (which may contain up to five inoculations in one) or to spread them out. But that carries significant risks of its own. “Too often, an immunization delayed is an immunization missed,” says Dr. Schaffner. “It’s hard enough for parents to keep track.”

More troubling, during the gaps, kids are susceptible to catching serious diseases they could have been protected from. Vaccines are scheduled when they are for precise reasons: It’s a balance between finding the time when the baby’s immune system can respond and knowing when he’s most in danger of catching the infection, says Dr. Schuchat. Give a shot late and a child is left unprotected at his most vulnerable time.

Robert Sears, M.D., author of The Vaccine Book: Making the Right Decision for Your Child, offers parents an alternative to the American Academy of Pediatrics schedule—but he does so with Dr. Schuchat’s concerns in mind. There are certain vaccines, including those that protect against meningitis, rotavirus, and pertussis, that he does not recommend delaying for the same reason she gives. However, he willingly offers families the option of postponing hepatitis A and B as well as polio, mainly because these illnesses do not pose the same threat to infants as the others.

*** continued below ***

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Posted: 06 November 2008 04:04 AM   [ # 2 ]
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*** continued from above ***

The worry: Vaccines contain toxins

What’s behind it: Vaccines do contain a variety of substances besides the viral or bacterial components. There are preservatives as well as adjuvants, which are substances that help vaccines grab the attention of the immune system and prompt it to create antibodies. One adjuvant that some are focusing on is aluminum, which at chronic high levels can contribute to nerve, brain, and kidney damage. Because several new vaccines containing aluminum have been added to the schedule, some parents and doctors worry that the extra exposure might push levels out of the safety zone—particularly given that there’s already aluminum pretty much everywhere: in water, breast milk, formula, and the air we breathe. “I’m concerned that health officials haven’t done any human-infant research to make sure the amount of aluminum in the vaccines is safe,” says Dr. Sears.

The facts: Everyday exposure to aluminum is generally not considered hazardous—most adults ingest 7 to 9 milligrams (mg) every day through food alone (up to 200 mg if they pop antacids), and formula contains anywhere from .05 mg/L to .93 mg/L. Very little of the aluminum taken in orally is absorbed, and what does make it into the bloodstream is excreted within days. Although the aluminum in vaccines is, of course, injected, there doesn’t seem to be evidence it poses any danger for healthy kids. The amount of aluminum injected is no more than .85 mg per dose, and the CDC, the Institute of Medicine, and the World Health Organization have all deemed the levels babies receive from shots to be safe.

However, if you still have concerns, you can ask your doctor to choose low- or no-aluminum vaccines when possible. In the instances when it’s not, Dr. Sears will work with aluminum-wary parents by having them bring their babies in once a month between 2 and 7 months of age (rather than bimonthly) so that they get just one aluminum-containing shot at a time. “If doctors don’t meet worried parents halfway, the problem of kids not getting vaccinated will continue,” says Dr. Sears.

The worry: It’s healthier to contract some diseases naturally

What’s behind it: The immunity one develops against chicken pox and measles after having the illness is more complete than the protection from the shot. Because that fact is so appealing, chicken pox and measles parties—where parents intentionally expose a child to the viruses—have been around for years, and are now on the upswing.

Rebecca Foster threw one after her husband, Kevin Burget, came down with shingles, an illness that’s caused by the same virus behind chicken pox. The Brooklyn, New York, couple had elected not to vaccinate their then 2-year-old son, Hart, against chicken pox (he’d had all his other shots), and they seized the opportunity for the toddler to get it from his dad. The two shared lots of hugs and lots of cups—and sure enough, Hart picked up the pox. “He hardly itched. It was very mild—not like the horror stories we’d heard,” says Foster.

Knowing other parents might want their kids exposed, the couple posted a notice on a local e-mail listserve inviting interested families to come over; two ultimately showed up for a playdate with Hart, during which sharing everything, including lollipops, was encouraged. The visiting kids didn’t get sick, but their parents were highly grateful for the chance. “They brought presents,” says Foster.

The facts: The potential complications of both chicken pox and measles are far more dangerous than any posed by the shots. “Many young parents think these infections are trivial,” Dr. Schaffner says, “which only means they’ve never seen a child seriously ill with either of them.” Consider this: Complications include seizures, pneumonia, or encephalitis (brain inflammation); one or two of every thousand children who come down with measles die or are mentally impaired. In pregnant women, measles can cause miscarriage and premature birth. Chicken pox can lead to staph or strep infections.

Dr. Myers has seen the effects of those infections firsthand. He recalls a 19-month-old whose parents decided he was getting too many shots at once and left off the chicken pox vaccine. “The boy came to our hospital with staph and strep skin infections. It required powerful antibiotics to save him.”

To be fair, most kids who get chicken pox will not end up in the hospital. But, like Dr. Myers’s patient, a few will—and there’s a good chance their parents never would have believed it could happen to them. “We’d all love to have absolute truths and guarantees, but that’s not always attainable,” says Dr. Shoffner. Vaccines are no exception. “We have to make the best decisions we can with the best information available to us.”

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Posted: 06 November 2008 05:12 AM   [ # 3 ]
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Basically the article focuses on what happens, both good and bad, or uncomfortable to the single individual and only a cursory view of those beyond the individual.

Vaccinations were and still are the avenue through which the ENTIRE public is protected from devastating diseases and death.  If a child becomes ill because he/she has not been vaccinated, they become the petri environment bomb that can easily infect many others.  So, when a parent selects to vaccinate or not, they must also assume the responsibility to strangers beyond their front door.

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Posted: 06 November 2008 05:30 AM   [ # 4 ]
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Agreed, Huli.

Germs, like all living organisms, are good at exploiting any little advantage they can get, and finding a kid who’s not immunzed, and spreading to anyone else who’s not immune.. Oh yeah, they love that.  Not all kids who are not immunized are skipped due to parental fears. A lot of them come fom negligent homes, or low-income families that can’t afford proper health care.

Any kids I have are going to be immunized against anything and everything possible, up to and including Dutch Elm Disease.

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Posted: 06 November 2008 07:26 AM   [ # 5 ]
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Well, given that cooties exist, my kids were vaccinated as was I.

My son ended up with the chicken pox and the poor boy was covered in spots for a while.

It breaks my heart to see such a sad face - he still has “spot” the puppy

I suffered terribly from tonsilitis as a child and missed a lot of school because of it. I can only imagine what it would have been like if I had the other stuff (MMR etc.)

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Posted: 06 November 2008 08:19 AM   [ # 6 ]
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And I’m GUILTY of giving the entire kindergarten german measles.  I knew I didn’t feel good but we were scheduled for a class trip by railroad train so I lied to my parents on that day and then could barely move.  When we returned, the teacher called my mother to let her know I was walking home (it was about a block) but she was concerned because it seemed I was running a fever….............

I spent two week isolated in a dark room even over my own birthday (spring).

German measles are VERY dangerous and can be deadly.  They can cause loss of hearing etc.  At that time there was NO vaccination for this so not only was the entire class shut down, but each of those families were also compromised.

It was shortly after that when polio hit.  MANY children became disabled and shriveled from it.  The streets where we played became deserts where only the leaves chittered.  I remember watching from the window knowing I wasn’t permitted to go out because so many homes had big quarantine signs on them.  It was one of the most horrifying pandemics I can remember even though I was very young.  When the vaccine was formulated, entire schools were lined up to receive it. 

Tuberculosis was also still rampant as was smallpox and children received both testing for these in class as well as vaccine for smallpox.

Believe me you do NOT want to see these kinds of diseases return!

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Posted: 06 November 2008 08:51 AM   [ # 7 ]
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I had some big concerns over vaccines.  In the end, my mom gave me the advice my pediatrician had given her when I was a baby.  We live in a very transient society.  People who have NEVER been vaccinated are coming into contact with you whether you realize it or not.

The people who handle your food at restaurants & grocery stores, the clerks taking your money ANYWHERE.  Kids at the park playing with your child…etc.

Jocelynn seems to be fine…Anicah gets very irritable afterwards, but ultimately I want her protected.  I have been poked by needles before, and it only stings for a second.  So I know that my child’s pain isn’t much worse than that.

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Posted: 06 November 2008 12:04 PM   [ # 8 ]
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I would rather my son be autistic, which he is, than dead.  Not much more to say than that.

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Posted: 06 November 2008 01:34 PM   [ # 9 ]
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There are a lot more people that are considered autistic now a days.  This is a much broader term than many consider it is.  There is no conclusive proof that vaccinations lead to autism.  What floors me so much are the people that smoke around their kids yet have doubts about vaccinations.  I don’t want (puff) want to expose my kids (puff) to mercury and other (puff) dangerous chemicals (puff).  If I remember correctly 99% of the population has in their systems the cancer causing chemical that is in teflon (the nonstick stuff on many pans and skillits) yet people continue to use these instead of stainless steal and /or iron skillits.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 04:41 AM   [ # 10 ]
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I remember having the Chicken Pox when I was a young child.  I think I had the mumps and measles as well.  I don’t remember being deathly ill with any of those illnesses.  I know it’s important to be immunized against these things if you are an adult and have never had them because many can be very serious for adults.

Back in the day, they just immunized children against potentially fatal or crippling diseases.  I was always under the impression that actually having chicken pox and measles etc… as a child strengthened that child’s immune system - a desirable side effect which lasted an entire lifetime.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 06:46 AM   [ # 11 ]
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Bebelicious - 07 November 2008 09:41 AM

I was always under the impression that actually having chicken pox and measles etc… as a child strengthened that child’s immune system - a desirable side effect which lasted an entire lifetime.

Which is exactly what vaccines should do, and with less risk of your kids’ brains melting or whatever.  Getting something such as chicken pox will only strengthen you immune system against chicken pox and related diseases.  It doesn’t strengthen your immune system against flu or mumps or whatever.  There is no overall boost to your immune system as a whole.  So the chicken pox vaccine should strengthen your immune system against the same things that the actual disease does.

I do agree with the people who worry that too many shots all in a short time can cause problems.  There have been quite a few times where I’d end up getting about twenty different vaccinations all in about five minutes’ time, and I’d sometimes be a mess for several days afterwards.  Presumably the doctors giving vaccines to the kids have some sort of a standard schedule and interval that has been tested to be sure that things like that don’t happen, though?

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Posted: 07 November 2008 11:27 AM   [ # 12 ]
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Bebe, those diseases can also kill an infant, or small child.  Why?  B/c their immune system is so new, it has no protection against the disease.  Just as an old persons system is so old, it may not be strong enough to protect.  Because of the large number of children who could NOT fight off the measles & mumps, and the complications involved with them (including chikenpox and shingles…which you CAN get twice…and if you’ve had once can turn into shingles as an ADULT) it was thought that a vaccination against those diseases would be more beneficial than harmful.  The child’s immune system can now fight off the disease if it comes into contact with it…or at least be able to handle it if they get it.  Children who get diseases they have been vaccinated for often suffer less than those who have not been vaccinated at all.  Their body recognizes the disease & sends out the appropriate antibodies.

One thing I do NOT do is the flu vaccine.  Because there are so many different strains of the flu, the shot is only good against the strain that doctors & researchers THINK might be the most prevalent in that particular flu season.  If you run into another strain, your shot was for naught.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 01:17 PM   [ # 13 ]
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It is true that some people because of age, too young or too old, or those whose systems are now compromised by other medical complications cannot effectively fight off some of these seeming innocuous illnesses. 

That’s pretty much the point though in vaccinating children; not just to protect them, but to also protect others who are vulnerable and may not even know it.  These aren’t just for the single child, but to protect the public. 

Most good parents do take their child into public arenas, home, to the store, movies, restaurants.  While visiting these places many strangers are also about and can be exposed to something a small child is only just ‘coming’ down with that a parent has not yet realized.  It’s during that time that such illnesses can be released upon unsuspecting folks who may become far more ill than the child who has infected them. 

Maegan, I do get flu shots now, even though I know it only protects from certain strains (which continue to mutate).  Several years ago the teen daughter of a very good friend seemed to have a mild cold when we visited.  It was not a cold but a flu and while she was only mildly affected, both Erik and I were severally debilitated and were VERY fearful that we were going to have to go to the hospital.  It was a two-week event and I NEVER, EVER, want to go through it again…I have not been that sick and delirious with fever in many years.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 02:25 PM   [ # 14 ]
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Right…there are plenty of “typhoid Marys” running around that don’t even realize it.  I have a friend that is a TB carrier.  He would never get the disease himself, but he can pass it to people.  So those who come from places where the diseases may still be prevalent may be immune themselves, they can still pass it on to those who have not been vaccinated.  And that was the main reason I thought vaccines were a good idea.  My kids might not spend a lot of time in foreign countries…but people (and animals, and food…and clothes) from foreign countries (and thus not protected against common contagions) are everywhere.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 08:16 PM   [ # 15 ]
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I had mumps for 2 weeks then suddenly on the night before i was allowed to go back to school i was sick again and another week in bed.

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Posted: 07 November 2008 08:58 PM   [ # 16 ]
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I have had neices and nephews who have had menigitis.  I am a big advocate of vaccinations because I have seen things that could have been prevented.  I will ask anyone to please protect your and your familys health as much as you can because the alternitive is misery

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Posted: 08 November 2008 05:00 AM   [ # 17 ]
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Maegan - 07 November 2008 04:27 PM

Bebe, those diseases can also kill an infant, or small child.  Why?  B/c their immune system is so new, it has no protection against the disease.


Rarely are they fatal.  I’m not sure where you got your info.  Link to it, please, as I’d like to educate myself.  My understanding was that mother’s milk offers most of the immunity a child needs while developing their own immune systems.

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Posted: 08 November 2008 05:05 AM   [ # 18 ]
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I am an ex associate - 08 November 2008 01:58 AM

I have had neices and nephews who have had menigitis.  I am a big advocate of vaccinations because I have seen things that could have been prevented.  I will ask anyone to please protect your and your familys health as much as you can because the alternitive is misery


A coworkers who sits in front of me got taken away by EMS three weeks ago.  When they diagnosed meningitis, hazmat came in one night and…. well hazmatted our area.  Nice. 

I don’t have a problem so much with vaccinations, but too many at once can be a strain on the body.

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Posted: 08 November 2008 05:29 AM   [ # 19 ]
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Bebelicious - 08 November 2008 10:00 AM
Maegan - 07 November 2008 04:27 PM

Bebe, those diseases can also kill an infant, or small child.  Why?  B/c their immune system is so new, it has no protection against the disease.


Rarely are they fatal.  I’m not sure where you got your info.  Link to it, please, as I’d like to educate myself.  My understanding was that mother’s milk offers most of the immunity a child needs while developing their own immune systems.

Breast-feeding babies does let them build up their internal supply of friendly bacteria in their intestines, which do help in a small way to keep them from being infected by other bacteria.  But as far as antibodies, I believe that the milk only lends the baby the mother’s antibodies, rather than allowing the baby to produce such antibodies on its own.  So for as long as you’re giving your baby your milk it will have your antibodies in its system, but once you stop feeding it on your milk then the antibodies will soon all degrade or be flushed out of the baby’s system, leaving it without any defence against those diseases.  There is some evidence that suggests breast-feeding helps the baby’s immune system develop antibodies faster when the need arises, but that still depends on the baby producing antibodies rather than borrowing them from the mother.

If the baby does contract a disease while you are providing it with your own antibodies against the disease, then that should both keep the disease from harming your baby and let the baby’s immune system learn about the disease and start producing its own antibodies.  But since you don’t know which antibodies you may have or which ones are successfully circulating through your kids, you still don’t really want to be exposing your baby to anything nasty even while it’s all filled up with you milk.

So while milk lends the child the mother’s antibodies for as long as the child drinks the milk, a vaccine (or exposure to the disease itself) gives the child the ability to produce its own antibodies and thus provides long-term self-sufficient protection against the disease.  The vaccine has an advantage over contracting the disease naturally, though, in that the child has much less chance of coming to harm while acquiring the ability to produce antibodies.  Unless you plan to breast-feed your children for their entire lives, vaccinations are going to be your best option.

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Posted: 08 November 2008 11:08 AM   [ # 20 ]
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http://www.breastfeeding.com/kh_articles/article_58517_1.html

Infants are generally protected from measles for 6 to 8 months after birth due to immunity passed on from their mothers. Older kids are usually immunized against measles according to state and school health regulations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measels#Prevention_and_Public_health

Unvaccinated populations are at risk for the disease. After vaccination rates dropped in northern Nigeria in the early 2000s due to religious and political objections, the number of cases rose significantly, and hundreds of children died.[6] A 2005 measles outbreak in Indiana was attributed to children whose parents refused vaccination.[7] In the early 2000s the MMR vaccine controversy in the United Kingdom regarding a potential link between the combined MMR vaccine (vaccinating children from mumps, measles and rubella) and autism prompted a comeback in the measles party, where parents deliberately infect the child with measles to build up the child’s immunity without an injection. This practice poses many health risks to the child, and has been discouraged by the public health authorities.[8] Scientific evidence provides no support for the hypothesis that MMR plays a role in causing autism.[9] However, the MMR scare in Britain caused uptake of the vaccine to plunge, and measles cases came back: 2007 saw 971 cases in England and Wales, the biggest rise in occurrence in measles cases since records began in 1995.[10]

According to the World Health Organization (WHO), measles is a leading cause of vaccine preventable childhood mortality.

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Posted: 08 November 2008 11:48 AM   [ # 21 ]
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prior to smallpox vaccinations, millions died or were very disfigured by the disease.  For all you males out there, if mumps were not contracted as a child, do you really want to bet you cojones(sp) on getting it as an adult?

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Posted: 08 November 2008 09:22 PM   [ # 22 ]
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I am an ex associate - 08 November 2008 04:48 PM

prior to smallpox vaccinations, millions died or were very disfigured by the disease.  For all you males out there, if mumps were not contracted as a child, do you really want to bet you cojones(sp) on getting it as an adult?

“Mumps is a funny thing.. If you have it as a kid, you don’t get it as an adult. But if you get it as an adult, you don’t have kids. Take *that* you little home-wreckers!” (proceeds to spray the room with more disinfectant) - Col. Maxwell Klinger.

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Posted: 09 November 2008 05:12 AM   [ # 23 ]
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Robin Bobcat - 09 November 2008 02:22 AM
I am an ex associate - 08 November 2008 04:48 PM

prior to smallpox vaccinations, millions died or were very disfigured by the disease.  For all you males out there, if mumps were not contracted as a child, do you really want to bet you cojones(sp) on getting it as an adult?

“Mumps is a funny thing.. If you have it as a kid, you don’t get it as an adult. But if you get it as an adult, you don’t have kids. Take *that* you little home-wreckers!” (proceeds to spray the room with more disinfectant) - Col. Maxwell Klinger.

I didn’g get any vaccinations until I Was in my late teens.  I suppsoe that it’s a good thing from the standpoint of future generations of diatom-dragon hybrids that I managed to at least avoid mumps for those later years. . .

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Posted: 24 December 2008 01:53 PM   [ # 24 ]
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Madmouse - 08 November 2008 04:08 PM

http://www.breastfeeding.com/kh_articles/article_58517_1.html

Infants are generally protected from measles for 6 to 8 months after birth due to immunity passed on from their mothers. Older kids are usually immunized against measles according to state and school health regulations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measels#Prevention_and_Public_health

Unvaccinated populations are at risk for the disease. After vaccination rates dropped in northern Nigeria in the early 2000s due to religious and political objections, the number of cases rose significantly, and hundreds of children died.[6] A 2005 measles outbreak in Indiana was attributed to children whose parents refused vaccination.[7] In the early 2000s the MMR vaccine controversy in the United Kingdom regarding a potential link between the combined MMR vaccine (vaccinating children from mumps, measles and rubella) and autism prompted a comeback in the measles party, where parents deliberately infect the child with measles to build up the child’s immunity without an injection. This practice poses many health risks to the child, and has been discouraged by the public health authorities.[8] Scientific evidence provides no support for the hypothesis that MMR plays a role in causing autism.[9] However, the MMR scare in Britain caused uptake of the vaccine to plunge, and measles cases came back: 2007 saw 971 cases in England and Wales, the biggest rise in occurrence in measles cases since records began in 1995.[10]

According to the World Health Organization (WHO), measles is a leading cause of vaccine preventable childhood mortality.

There is alot of poverty in Nigeria. Many do not have running water, electricity, access to good health care, and sewage contaminates their drinking water. (And this info should have been included in that Wikipedia article so as to help people make as informed of a decision as possible) In a country like this, survival chances are going to be dramatically lower. Our own children are not likely to suffer nearly as drastic of consequences of the disease as the children of Nigeria.

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Posted: 24 December 2008 06:42 PM   [ # 25 ]
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Nigeria is not the only country rift with these conditions.  In fact problems such as these exist as well in the most seeming prosperous countries where many erroneously believe that ALL citizens and their children have access to not only running water and upscale medical (and other) technology and health care.  These are the children that are even more carefully hidden and forgotten than those in obvious global areas of poverty.

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Posted: 24 December 2008 06:52 PM   [ # 26 ]
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Oy.. Necroposting..

Yes, you are correct that Nigeria (and other, similar nations) have a great deal of poverty and hideous health care. The average amount of health care in developed nations is signifigantly better.

However, not everyone in those developed nations receive better health care. Additionally, a large portion of that better health care is simply the availability of vaccinations at a young age. Even with the best health care available to them, there will still be a death rate from those diseases. Any chance I have to keep any potential kids I have from dying of an otherwise preventable disease will be taken.

I will agree that pointing to Nigerian death rates and claiming that developed nation death rates would be the same is irresponsible and alarmist. However that is not what the Wiki article is doing. They are demonstrating the effect that lack of vaccines had upon an area which already had poor health care. As you said, the chances of a child contracting any disease in such conditions are signifigantly lower. As a result, more children will die from disease, as opposed to just ‘being sick for a couple weeks, then getting better’, which is harder to keep track of statistically. Therefore, you can effectively correlate vaccination rates with the death rates, and see that a drop in vaccination rates results in a rise in death rates.

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Posted: 24 December 2008 06:54 PM   [ # 27 ]
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I agree huli, Normally people who do this are in fact descendants or people coming from that country or activists for that country you must remember kelly, that my country the philipines is a hell area we also have problems. Also about 80% of the worlds countries are at least developing or have been a developing country, So here thats the problem these days you see the UN and other relief groups go to as many developing countries as they can. I guess Nigeria is one but they cant get that much relief since they help all other countries not just nigeria.

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Posted: 24 December 2008 07:03 PM   [ # 28 ]
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Kelly - 24 December 2008 06:53 PM

There is alot of poverty in Nigeria. Many do not have running water, electricity, access to good health care, and sewage contaminates their drinking water. (And this info should have been included in that Wikipedia article so as to help people make as informed of a decision as possible) In a country like this, survival chances are going to be dramatically lower. Our own children are not likely to suffer nearly as drastic of consequences of the disease as the children of Nigeria.

But you must also remember that india even if it is big is also 3rd world and if you say they might be growing that still does not change the fact. It seems that you are saying that we must actually add that information in the article but we must also remember that vaccines are expensive and many people in africa cant get to a hospital many people in africa are iliterate many people in africa have not even heard of vaccines many people in africa still use witch doctors, many people in africa dont know why they have so many children, you must put the fact that theyre not as intelligent as some americans we must remember that people in developing countries all need help not just one country. So basically all countries have dramatically lower survival chances to Hi tech countries also they were using nigeria as an a example about the risk and the power of disease im sure many americans and people not just you know about whats happening in nigeria i mean im just very young and i know about many tragedies.

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Posted: 24 December 2008 07:48 PM   [ # 29 ]
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silver, I think you stated that very well.  I’m actually very proud of you little one!

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Posted: 24 December 2008 08:16 PM   [ # 30 ]
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*Bow*

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Posted: 25 December 2008 12:05 PM   [ # 31 ]
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African people know why they have so many kids.  Consider that many societys still put a lot of stock in having a lot of kids.  Catch-22 so many kids die that to have more you ensure that you will have surviving kids.  Include that women often times have little choice in sex relations.

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Posted: 25 December 2008 07:30 PM   [ # 32 ]
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The very poor have “so many” kids…not b/c they figure SOMEONE will survive…but b/c of the lack of birth control options or education.  And in places that are patriarchal driven societies, having many children is a sign of strength or super machismo.

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Posted: 10 April 2013 01:24 AM   [ # 33 ]
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An old thread bump, but this is relevant to the topic

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22085678

It is 15 years since Dr Andrew Wakefield published research suggesting a possible link between the MMR vaccine and autism.

Although both he and his research have been discredited, the MMR scare still casts a long shadow.

That may seem improbable, given that MMR coverage rates now exceed the level they achieved before his claims were published in 1992.

First dose MMR coverage for England now stands at 89% in England and 92.7% in Wales - and latest quarterly figures for both countries suggest rates are edging towards the crucial 95% uptake the World Health Organisation says is needed to provide herd immunity and provide full protection.

But in 2004 it fell to 80% in England and 78% in Wales. That means more than 100,000 children were not protected in that year alone.

There is now a huge cohort of children who are not protected and this has allowed the measles virus to circulate - often infecting babies who are too young to have had the MMR vaccine.

There were 2,016 confirmed cases of measles in England and Wales in 2012, the highest total for 18 years.

The number of cases in the current Swansea outbreak has reached 620.

more at the link.

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Posted: 10 April 2013 02:15 AM   [ # 34 ]
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Pertussis (whooping cough) is on the rise again too as a result of people refusing to vaccinate their children. In a young born, it can be deadly.

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Posted: 10 April 2013 08:23 AM   [ # 35 ]
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LaMa - 10 April 2013 02:15 AM

Pertussis (whooping cough) is on the rise again too as a result of people refusing to vaccinate their children. In a young born, it can be deadly.

There should be a special place in Hell for parents who make such decisions.

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Posted: 10 April 2013 09:42 AM   [ # 36 ]
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Peter - 10 April 2013 08:23 AM
LaMa - 10 April 2013 02:15 AM

Pertussis (whooping cough) is on the rise again too as a result of people refusing to vaccinate their children. In a young born, it can be deadly.

There should be a special place in Hell for parents who make such decisions.

Indeed.  They have designed their children to be ticking-time-bombs for the rest of the population.

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Posted: 21 April 2013 12:13 AM   [ # 37 ]
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In a “poke in the eye” for the anti vaccination twerps, I had my flu shot today.

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